Is the new Catechism the final authority?

[StrictCatholicGirl]

The catechism is not infallible but it's based on the Church's infallible teachings. It is not intended to be exhaustive, but is simply a guideline for living the Catholic life.

There have been many catechisms in the history of the Church and each one injects a little of the personality of the author/s. They address important issues in the Church and the culture at large at the time of publication. This will result in additional information in some catechisms, and omissions in other catechisms.

For example, the new catechism addresses the danger of horoscopes and New Age-ism which simply was not an issue in the time of Trent. The Trent Catechism focused on the errors of Protestants. The new catechism revisits the "just war" theory seeing as we have enough nuclear bombs to blow our planet to smithereens. It challenges us to seek more peaceful solutions to the age-old problem of war.

With so much confusion and contrasting interpretations of "what does the Church really teach" these days.. your friend (who is probably just an average Catholic who is not going to plow through Church councils and old papal documents) has found solace in just sticking with the CCC and I can't say I blame him. I do the same.

- Lisa

[Valz]

The catechism is not infallible but it's based on the Church's infallible teachings. It is not intended to be exhaustive, but is simply a guideline for living the Catholic life.

There have been many catechisms in the history of the Church and each one injects a little of the personality of the author/s. They address important issues in the Church and the culture at large at the time of publication. This will result in additional information in some catechisms, and omissions in other catechisms.

For example, the new catechism addresses the danger of horoscopes and New Age-ism which simply was not an issue in the time of Trent. The Trent Catechism focused on the errors of Protestants. The new catechism revisits the "just war" theory seeing as we have enough nuclear bombs to blow our planet to smithereens. It challenges us to seek more peaceful solutions to the age-old problem of war.

With so much confusion and contrasting interpretations of "what does the Church really teach" these days.. your friend (who is probably just an average Catholic who is not going to plow through Church councils and old papal documents) has found solace in just sticking with the CCC and I can't say I blame him. I do the same.

- Lisa

I can understand this. However I think it reflects the wrong mind set to adopt a sola scriptura attitude(something which I think this person carried over from his former protestanism) with the catechism and ignore councils and papal decrees. It can lead to a flawed and distorted understanding of the faith.

[Mhoram]

At best, the Catechism is a starting point.  We're going through it right now in adult religion class (actually, we're going through the Compendium, which is a stripped down, Baltimore-style Q&A version which references the Catechism on each point), and every section of the Catechism references Scripture, Council documents, the writings of the Church Fathers, etc.  Taking it as absolute by itself without researching and understanding those supporting documents would be just as faulty as Sola Scriptura is.  If the CCC claimed to be enough by itself, it wouldn't have all those footnotes.

[Valz]

Taking it as absolute by itself without researching and understanding those supporting documents would be just as faulty as Sola Scriptura is.

Indeed, that's how I see it too.

[Gregory the Eremite]

When it comes to discerning doctrine, is the new Catechism the final authority for Catholics?

The then Cardinal Ratzinger wrote that: "The individual doctrines which the Catechism presents receive no other weight than that which they already possess." ("Introduction to the Catechism".)

Gregory.

[Herr_Mannelig]

In my copy of the Catechism, there is an introduction which has the Apostolic Constitution "Fidei Depositum", and at the end it says:

This Catechism is not intended to replace the local catechisms duly approved by the ecclesiastical authorities...

I would recommend, without getting in depth with the statements here, ask this person for their catechism and look in the beginning for any statement which says the catechism is not a final authority and is only a reference for teaching. When someone says a document is a final authority, usually the document itself can say otherwise, which leads to an interesting state of mind

[Valz]

In my copy of the Catechism, there is an introduction which has the Apostolic Constitution "Fidei Depositum", and at the end it says:

This Catechism is not intended to replace the local catechisms duly approved by the ecclesiastical authorities...

I would recommend, without getting in depth with the statements here, ask this person for their catechism and look in the beginning for any statement which says the catechism is not a final authority and is only a reference for teaching. When someone says a document is a final authority, usually the document itself can say otherwise, which leads to an interesting state of mind

Sure but in the same constitution it says: "This catechism is given to them that it may be a sure and authentic reference text for teaching catholic doctrine and particularly for preparing local catechisms."

That could be used to support the mindset that for Catholics, the Catechism is the final authority given by The Church to discern doctrine.

[Mhoram]

A "reference" is generally a compilation of material from other sources, not a source of original ideas itself.  The quote from Cardinal Ratzinger supports that idea, that the CCC is meant to be a useful summary of doctrines that have already been defined elsewhere.  To the extent that it reproduces those doctrines correctly, they have the weight they already had.  To the extent that it introduces new ideas or conclusions of its own, we should approach them carefully because that's not its purpose.

[Herr_Mannelig]

In my copy of the Catechism, there is an introduction which has the Apostolic Constitution "Fidei Depositum", and at the end it says:

This Catechism is not intended to replace the local catechisms duly approved by the ecclesiastical authorities...

I would recommend, without getting in depth with the statements here, ask this person for their catechism and look in the beginning for any statement which says the catechism is not a final authority and is only a reference for teaching. When someone says a document is a final authority, usually the document itself can say otherwise, which leads to an interesting state of mind

Sure but in the same constitution it says: "This catechism is given to them that it may be a sure and authentic reference text for teaching catholic doctrine and particularly for preparing local catechisms."

That could be used to support the mindset that for Catholics, the Catechism is the final authority given by The Church to discern doctrine.

It can't be both, so it must not be the final authority.

If someone can't accept that, they need to have their head examined.

[Valz]

The then Cardinal Ratzinger wrote that: "The individual doctrines which the Catechism presents receive no other weight than that which they already possess." ("Introduction to the Catechism".)

To give a fuller context to the quote above:

"This does not mean that the Catechism is a sort of super-dogma, as its opponents would like to insinuate in order to cast suspicion on it as a danger to the liberty of theology. What significance the Catechism really holds for the common exercise of teaching in the Church may be learned by reading the Apostolic Constitution Fidei depositum, with which the Pope promulgated it on October 11, 1992 - exactly thirty years after the opening of the Second Vatican Council: "I acknowledge it [the Catechism] as a valid and legitimate tool in the service of ecclesiastical communion, as a sure norm for instruction in the faith." The individual doctrines which the Catechism presents receive no other weight than that which they already posess."

I think some people see it as a sort of super-dogma, and not just those who see it as a danger to the "liberty" of theology.

[SouthpawLink]

Not even close.

The New Catechism is fraught with JPII's own prudential opinions (the entry on Capitol Punishment comes to mind). It does not enjoy the same status of the Roman Catechism of Trent which was the product of the Dogmatic Council of Trent which stated that the commission for a new Catechism was to result in an official authoritative catechetical text of the Church. In addition it was under the patronage and supervision of both Pope St. Pius V and St. Charles Borromeo.

But Pope John Paul II in his promulgation of the new Catechism, the constitution Fidei Depositum, said the following:

"The Catechism of the Catholic Church, which I approved 25 June last and the publication of which I today order by virtue of my Apostolic Authority, is a statement of the Church's faith and of catholic doctrine, attested to or illumined by Sacred Scripture, the Apostolic Tradition and the Church's Magisterium. I declare it to be a sure norm for teaching the faith and thus a valid and legitimate instrument for ecclesial communion. May it serve the renewal to which the Holy Spirit ceaselessly calls the Church of God, the Body of Christ, on her pilgrimage to the undiminished light of the Kingdom!

The approval and publication of the Catechism of the Catholic Church represent a service which the Successor of Peter wishes to offer to the Holy Catholic Church, to all the particular Churches in peace and communion with the Apostolic See: the service, that is, of supporting and confirming the faith of all the Lord Jesus' disciples (cf. Lk 22:32 as well as of strengthening the bonds of unity in the same apostolic faith. Therefore, I ask all the Church's Pastors and the Christian faithful to receive this catechism in a spirit of communion and to use it assiduously in fulfilling their mission of proclaiming the faith and calling people to the Gospel life. This catechism is given to them that it may be a sure and authentic reference text for teaching catholic doctrine and particularly for preparing local catechisms. It is also offered to all the faithful who wish to deepen their knowledge of the unfathomable riches of salvation"

Surely this counts as something? How does it not enjoys the same status as the Catechism of Trent which it intends to replace?

In truth, the intention of the Catechism of the Catholic Church was not to replace the Roman Catechism (Catechism of the Council of Trent). As the new Catechism itself says, "None of the creeds from the different stages in the Church's life can be considered superseded or irrelevant. They help us today to attain and deepen the faith of all times by means of the different summaries made of it" (par. 193).

If this is true of the creeds, then the same should be true of the Church's various catechisms (whether local or universal).


Then consider this exchange between Zenit and then-Cardinal Ratzinger (May 2, 2003):

Q: Speaking of St. Pius X's catechism, which continues to have sympathizers, will the publication of the compendium mean that it is definitively exceeded?

Cardinal Ratzinger: The faith, as such, is always the same. Therefore, St. Pius X's catechism always retains its value. However, the way of transmitting the contents of the faith can change.
 
Consequently, one can ask if St. Pius X's catechism can in this respect be regarded as still valid today. I think that the compendium we are preparing can respond better to today's needs. But this does not exclude the fact that there can be persons or groups that feel more comfortable with St. Pius X's catechism.

It should not be forgotten that that Catechism stemmed from a text that was prepared by the Pope himself [Pius X] when he was bishop of Mantua. The text was the fruit of the personal catechetical experience of Giuseppe Sarto, whose characteristics were simplicity of exposition and depth of content. Also because of this, St. Pius X's catechism might have friends in the future. But this does not make our work superfluous.

http://www.zenit.org/article-7161?l=english


To answer the question of the thread: I would hesitate to call the new Catechism the final authority with respect to non-defined doctrines, as those doctrines are usually better or more-deeply explained in the best theology manuals. Other catechisms, and even theology manuals are oftentimes more concise in their explanations of doctrine, and I generally consult them before turning to the Catechism of the Catholic Church.

[SouthpawLink]

The catechism is not infallible but it's based on the Church's infallible teachings. It is not intended to be exhaustive, but is simply a guideline for living the Catholic life.

There have been many catechisms in the history of the Church and each one injects a little of the personality of the author/s. They address important issues in the Church and the culture at large at the time of publication. This will result in additional information in some catechisms, and omissions in other catechisms.

For example, the new catechism addresses the danger of horoscopes and New Age-ism which simply was not an issue in the time of Trent. The Trent Catechism focused on the errors of Protestants. The new catechism revisits the "just war" theory seeing as we have enough nuclear bombs to blow our planet to smithereens. It challenges us to seek more peaceful solutions to the age-old problem of war.

With so much confusion and contrasting interpretations of "what does the Church really teach" these days.. your friend (who is probably just an average Catholic who is not going to plow through Church councils and old papal documents) has found solace in just sticking with the CCC and I can't say I blame him. I do the same.

- Lisa

I can understand this. However I think it reflects the wrong mind set to adopt a sola scriptura attitude(something which I think this person carried over from his former protestanism) with the catechism and ignore councils and papal decrees. It can lead to a flawed and distorted understanding of the faith.

I pretty much had that attitude when I first came back to the faith. The Bible and the Catechism were all I needed, heh heh. Thankfully (praise be to God), I now know better.

Now it's: the Bible, the Catechims (new and old), the Councils, the Fathers, the Doctors (especially St. Thomas Aquinas), the Papal decrees (papalencyclicals.net) and FishEaters! 

[Valz]

In truth, the intention of the Catechism of the Catholic Church was not to replace the Roman Catechism (Catechism of the Council of Trent). As the new Catechism itself says, "None of the creeds from the different stages in the Church's life can be considered superseded or irrelevant. They help us today to attain and deepen the faith of all times by means of the different summaries made of it" (par. 193).

If this is true of the creeds, then the same should be true of the Church's various catechisms (whether local or universal).

That's a good observation actually. Thanks also for the interview.