Nudity and Sin

[NathanSoc]

Anyone who stares laciviously at a nursing mother needs a punch in the mouth.  Maybe a second one to the gut for doing it inside a church.

Ah yes, Mikey - the Beavis to Marty's Butthead. Now I'm definitely giving this thread 5 stars.

[MikeSearson]

Anyone who stares laciviously at a nursing mother needs a punch in the mouth.  Maybe a second one to the gut for doing it inside a church.

Ah yes, Mikey - the Beavis to Marty's Butthead. Now I'm definitely giving this thread 5 stars.

Do you take offense, NathanSac?

Is your problem that you constantly think of women as sex-objects and breeding sows? 

Or are you just Stewart trying to look cool in a Winger shirt?

[winoblue1]

Thanks for the comments on my comment....

To clarify,,,, I guess I should rephrase and say "murder is wrong a priori"

Also, when I suggested a woman should think about using a bottle for feeding during mass, i didn't think that she needs to do it all the time, just perhaps once a week,,, once a week certainly won't cause any ill health concerns.

and finally regarding leaving children at home, I really think that one is exaggerating if they think that leaving young children at home for a few hours with a babysitter is going to negatively affect them. Also, I think that some women might find attending mass without their babies a more spiritually beneficial experience. But again, I was only suggesting it as an option, not a general rule.

Personally I have no problem with a mother stealing away to the cry room to nurse if she needs to. I just think that it need not be done where it would attract attention. I still remember one mother at the chapel in Canada I used to attend, she would be in the cry-room with her baby feeding and holding it, and she had the most beautiful disposition. Almost an image of Our Blessed Mother... clearly there wasn't any sexual overtones in the way she handled this situation. She was the mother of 8 (at that time) toddlers and they were all quiet and well behaved at mass.

Thanks again for the comments.

[Liza_Do_A_Lot]

Edit: I would like to point out that the cry room at St. Mary's is off-limits to men not in our crying room, fathers also take their crying babies in too and boys over the age of 5. The only people in there are mothers and their young children, and it's not like a "zoo cage" at all. Our crying room has a full length glass window, and it is like a 'zoo cage', it would be nice if they put some 'ciminal' mirrors on the outside....You can't even see it from a chapel, and it's accessed by going up a flight of stairs from the chapel vestibule. There are always ladies with their children in the cry room itself, and in the places outside the chapel. Usually if dad has to take care of one of the kids, he goes outside and does it in the fresh air.

Crying room at very back, domed shaped glass window....behind the pews.....centre of isle.

[Clare]

Also, when I suggested a woman should think about using a bottle for feeding during mass, i didn't think that she needs to do it all the time, just perhaps once a week,,, once a week certainly won't cause any ill health concerns and finally regarding leaving children at home, I really think that one is exaggerating if they think that leaving young children at home for a few hours with a babysitter is going to negatively affect them.

I don't have any babysitters. If I go to Mass the children have to come too. I can't drive, so I can't even leave them at home with dad! He has to go by himself or take all of us.

Also, I think that some women might find attending mass without their babies a more spiritually beneficial experience.

True. I'm not even nursing now, but I'm fed up with travelling at least 50 miles to Mass, only to spend it all in the repository or coffee room with one or both of the children, because they simply will not behave!

Clare.

[CaroleK]

Also, when I suggested a woman should think about using a bottle for feeding during mass, i didn't think that she needs to do it all the time, just perhaps once a week,,, once a week certainly won't cause any ill health concerns.

As was explained at least once in this thread - An infant becomes accustomed to either their mother's breast or the nipple on a bottle and the majority of infants will not/cannot simply switch back and forth.  A breastfed infant will usually not accept a latex bottle nipple.  This is such a common issue that there is even a name for it.  Nipple confusion.

To a nursing mother and infant trying to introduce a bottle once a week would create many many more problems than it would solve.  And the resulting confusion in trying to feed a hungry breastfed infant with a bottle would create far more of a distraction to both mother and those congregated for worship than discreetly nursing.

and finally regarding leaving children at home, I really think that one is exaggerating if they think that leaving young children at home for a few hours with a babysitter is going to negatively affect them. Also, I think that some women might find attending mass without their babies a more spiritually beneficial experience. But again, I was only suggesting it as an option, not a general rule.

The flaw with this is that most people don't have a sitter to leave their child with on Sunday mornings.  Most of the people I know and all of the people with whom I would trust my infant child (if I still had one) are at church on Sunday mornings.

There's also the issue, that has again already been explained, of the physical discomfort created by a nursing mother who has to skip nursing for some reason as well as the problems of milk let down and leakage when a baby (and that can be any child) cries or mom thinks about nursing.

From my personal experience it was far more distracting for me to try to sit through church services while worrying about my daughter than it was to simply have her with me.  But I can understand to an extent why a man wouldn't understand the maternal/infant bond and further be unable to understand the mechanics and physiology of breastfeeding (particularly if he himself is not a parent).  This is not meant as an insult but simply a statement of fact.  There are certain aspects of parenting than you simply don't understand until you have to deal with it yourself and there are aspects of motherhood that no man, no matter how well intentioned or empathetic can full comprehend and appreciate.

Personally I have no problem with a mother stealing away to the cry room to nurse if she needs to. I just think that it need not be done where it would attract attention. I still remember one mother at the chapel in Canada I used to attend, she would be in the cry-room with her baby feeding and holding it, and she had the most beautiful disposition. Almost an image of Our Blessed Mother... clearly there wasn't any sexual overtones in the way she handled this situation. She was the mother of 8 (at that time) toddlers and they were all quiet and well behaved at mass.

Of course you don't have a problem with that.  Again in part because of your limited comprehension of the situation.  So 'stealing away' (which means to leave furtively or stealthily and implies that mother must skulk to her corner to feed her child) to the cry room to feed her infant child probably does seem perfectly acceptable to you.

How do you know that the mother you describe was feeding her child?  Were you focusing on her and not on the Mass?  If so I'd say you have a problem with your attention span.

I'm betting you've been around a lot more nursing infants than you are aware of.

It astounds me that we're 9 pages into this discussion.  For a group of people (and I refer primarily to the men in this forum) who are pro-life and pro-family and encourage large families as part of our religious beliefs we certainly are squeamish about what it takes to raise those families.

[Jarrod_D]

We make it sound like women enjoy breast feeding in public. The word "selfish" and "motherhood," have nothing common.

Jarrod

[CaroleK]

We make it sound like women enjoy breast feeding in public. The word "selfish" and "motherhood," have nothing common.

Jarrod

That's it Jarrod.  You're found us out.  The only reason mothers breastfeed is so that we can do it in public to make other people uncomfortable.  The idea that we do it to provide sustenance and nourishment for our children is a smoke screen.

In fact the only reason we have children to begin with is so that we have an excuse to breastfeed.

What a silly topic this has turned out to be.

[winoblue1]

Quote:

How do you know that the mother you describe was feeding her child?  Were you focusing on her and not on the Mass?  If so I'd say you have a problem with your attention span.
_________________________________________

now now,,, no personal attacks,,,, don't even try to hypothesis about my mental states during mass please....

I am quite surprised that my rather reasonable opinion,,, which can basically be summed up as, "try to avoid it, if  you can't- just be modest" is causing so much reaction. I certainly don't think mothers want the freedom to "let it all hang out" so they can become a 'biological-buffet' during mass,,,,

So let's just agree that a mother should do what she can to be discreet and not draw attention to it. And this applies not just to breastfeeding or disciplining children but also to non-parents who are thumbing through missals, scratching their heads or fingering rosaries. Be quiet, modest and sensitive to other mass goers.....

Can we agree to this?

[littleway]

This thread was never about breast-feeding. Get over it.