Where have all the Cowboys Gone?

[Richeldis]

What makes you think that I would do that? I'd bring back a sweet, submissive, simple, silent, SSPX loving, traditional Catholic wife. Prolly oughta aim for Eastern Europe tho. What with Hilary Clinton and all I may just move there for keeps.

You haven't met many Eastern European women, have you?

[Richeldis]

 

 Erin!

[ggreg]

The third world marriage model is far superior to the modern west.  I love the idea of taking a third world woman back here, her remaining the same, and we living happily ever after, even if that isn't possible.

It is not possible in my experience.  People adapt to their surroundings and she'll make friends here, watch TV here and pick up women's magazines that are full of modern liberal ideas which you appear not to like.  Even if she doesn't agree with all of them it will begin to have an affect on her thinking.

I don't like the idea of living in some place where I never feel quite safe and I don't know what anyone is saying.

You'll learn the language, you'll probably have to in order to work and indeed converse with your wife.  With a little application it is not that difficult.  The idea that the third world is dangerous is wholly exaggerated.  There are loads of place I know that are safer than here.  Even Colombia which is supposed to be this really scary country full of kidnappings and murders is actually amazingly safe if you melt in to the general population, and follow local advice.  Generally speaking you become part of a larger family unit in the third world and all support each other.  Westerners are individualists all baying for our "rights" and our "freedoms"

There must be some way for me to have that marital life here.

Best of luck.  I'll pray for you.

[ggreg]

The third world marriage model is far superior to the modern west.  I love the idea of taking a third world woman back here, her remaining the same, and we living happily ever after, even if that isn't possible.  I don't like the idea of living in some place where I never feel quite safe and I don't know what anyone is saying.  There must be some way for me to have that marital life here, but if not maybe I'll pick up Spanish.

Why would you love the idea of bringing a third-world woman back to a culture that would corrupt your daughters to the point that they would be unmarriagable? I could be wrong but I think you need more than Spanish.  

Another thing to consider with this type of marriage is this.  If your relationship with your wife is like you want it to be, then she will want to socialise and talk to her sisters, mother, extended family and friends.  Unless you are going to bring them all over to the first world (going to cost a lot of money), and unless you want a lonely miserable wife then the best thing to do is move to the third world.

With a little more money than the rest of the population thing are nothing like as bad over there as people imagine.  You can live fairly comfortably over there and there are all sorts of advantages which you only understand when you're living there.  But the key to being contented is to leave the first world behind and do things the way that country does them.  When in Rome....

[CaroleK]

I just spent two weeks in a 'third world' country hanging out with some friends of mine.  And you know I gotta tell you, ggreg.  Your idea of what Central and South American marriages and societies are like would be laughable if it were not so insulting.  It certainly doesn't fit with the people I know who live in Central America (or recent immigrants from Central and South America).

In fact, the only types of marriages I am aware of that fit donum's "the woman is a mindless automaton without any opinions or ideas of her own, and if she dares to have an idea she'd better not voice it to him or his kids" ideal are radical fundamentalist Protestant sects who have so perverted the idea of marriage that it is barely recognizable and it certainly isn't Christian.

For the record though - I don't see what donum is asking for to be misogynistic so much as I do unrealistic.  Do you really believe that the ideal, model Catholic marriage is one in which the woman has no intellect at all?  Where she never speaks of anything more serious than asking what her beloved Lord and Master wants for dinner the next day?

My marriage is a partnership.  Equal?  Rarely.  Someone always seems to be giving or doing more than the other, but who is sacrificing more depends a lot on the day. 

My husband is the final arbiter of all things in our family. He is the spiritual head of the house and I often seek his counsel.  But he is also wise enough to know that he is the head of the family, not a dictator.  He takes into consideration my needs, desires and opinions.  In fact he actively seeks them.  That isn't a modern notion.  That isn't a "Western" notion.  It is in the Bible.  Again I exhort you all to read Proverbs 31 and what it says about a wife of noble character. 

That is not a description of a doormat.

I think that donum's list of "requirements" for a wife is immature and short-sighted and unlikely to be a formula for a happy, satisfying marriage or raising children who are well equipped to deal with the modern world and retain their faith.

[miss_fluffy]

From what I hear about South and Central America, there's plenty of hedonism going on, just of a different kind.  There are many women there who will swear to God that they are truly virgins when in reality they've done everything in the book but vaginal intercourse.  There's alot of adultery going on too, since many marriages are for money or convenience.  Your third-world wife might be good at playing the part, but better keep her locked up while you're not home.

[lefebvre_fan]

donumabdeo, I sincerely wish you the best of luck. Perhaps your personality and temperament would make you best suited to a largely subservient, passive and silent wife. If that's the case, and if marriage is your vocation, then I hope and pray that you find such a wife and that the two of you live happily together and have many children.  Quite frankly, not all men are the same - some are very assertive and independent, whilst others are more passive and dependent.

As for me, I'm not particularly assertive, so while I appreciate the leadership role of the husband, I'm more likely than not to rely on the advice and encouragement of my wife to help me fulfill that role. In that sense, I hope that my future wife (if God wills it) will have an intellect and be prepared to use it in the support of her husband and the raising and education of our children.

[Brede]

.
As for me, I'm not particularly assertive, so while I appreciate the leadership role of the husband, I'm more likely than not to rely on the advice and encouragement of my wife to help me fulfill that role. In that sense, I hope that my future wife (if God wills it) will have an intellect and be prepared to use it in the support of her husband and the raising and education of our children.

My husband is assertive as work, but at home he's quite willing to take a "back seat" to me. He trusts me to pay the bills (he's military and gone a lot), organize the education for our children (we home school), decide what we'll eat, where we'll live (after the military tells us the place! LOL), etc.

I know he appreciates these abilites of mine, and when he's gone he doesn't  waste any time worrying about whether the "home front" is doing okay.

[CaroleK]

but at home he's quite willing to take a "back seat" to me.

Take a "back seat" to you?  How pleasant.

My husband trusts me to take care of the bills (I've spent years working as an accountant).  He trusts me to do the daily managing of our household.  And to educate our daughter.  But I would never claim he "takes a back seat" to me.  That is a very demeaning turn of phrase. 

[Brede]

but at home he's quite willing to take a "back seat" to me.

Take a "back seat" to you?  How pleasant.

My husband trusts me to take care of the bills (I've spent years working as an accountant).  He trusts me to do the daily managing of our household.  And to educate our daughter.  But I would never claim he "takes a back seat" to me.  That is a very demeaning turn of phrase. 

Well, I don't think of it as demeaning. Basically, he's not "second guessing" my judgement. He trusts me to manage the affairs of our household, just as I trust him to manage the affairs of his paid job.

I'm not really sure how you look at that as demeaning ... When you're riding in the back seat, you're trusting the driver, aren't you?