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Author Topic: Catholic view of Israel - By Father Echert EWTN Q&A 02-06-2006  (Read 4604 times)
HMiS
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« Reply #10 on: March 10, 2008, 04:26:AM »

I fear Fr. Echert may get persecuted or prosecuted for this statement by the ADL, as his German-American-sounding name will probably ignite Abe Foxman.

Anyway, of course modern Israelis who lived there for 60 years have a right to live there and have citizenship too. But we may not call the State of Israel to be something divinely created. It may fullfil a prophecy, but a prophecy of iniquity and evil probably (Antichrist will take seat in earthly Jerusalem).

Although we must protect the civil rights of Israelis and Jews around the world, including in the Holy Land of course. They are our fellow human brothers, despite all differences and their irrational opposition to Christianity. 
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„Ja, Ja, wie Gott es will. Gott lohne es Euch. Gott schütze das liebe Vaterland. Für Ihn weiterarbeiten... oh, Du lieber Heiland!” ("Yes, Yes, as God wills it. May God repay it to you. May God protect the dear fatherland. Go on working for him... oh, you dear Savior!") - Clemens August Cardinal von Galen, his last words.
jovan66102
La foi Catholique d'abord! La mort à l'Islam!
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« Reply #11 on: March 10, 2008, 04:33:AM »

Quote from: HMiS
I fear Fr. Echert may get persecuted or prosecuted for this statement by the ADL, as his German-American-sounding name will probably ignite Abe Foxman.

Anyway, of course modern Israelis who lived there for 60 years have a right to live there and have citizenship too. But we may not call the State of Israel to be something divinely created. It may fullfil a prophecy, but a prophecy of iniquity and evil probably (Antichrist will take seat in earthly Jerusalem).

Although we must protect the civil rights of Israelis and Jews around the world, including in the Holy Land of course. They are our fellow human brothers, despite all differences and their irrational opposition to Christianity. 
 
Well said!
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Jovan-Marya Weismiller, T.O.Carm.

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Deum timete, regem honorificate.
werdegast
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« Reply #12 on: March 10, 2008, 09:07:AM »

Quote from: HMiS
I fear Fr. Echert may get persecuted or prosecuted for this statement by the ADL, as his German-American-sounding name will probably ignite Abe Foxman.

Anyway, of course modern Israelis who lived there for 60 years have a right to live there and have citizenship too. But we may not call the State of Israel to be something divinely created. It may fullfil a prophecy, but a prophecy of iniquity and evil probably (Antichrist will take seat in earthly Jerusalem).

Although we must protect the civil rights of Israelis and Jews around the world, including in the Holy Land of course. They are our fellow human brothers, despite all differences and their irrational opposition to Christianity. 


HMiS has a good point.  Although Father Echert's post has been online since 2006 I would highly recommend that anyone interesting in saving this make a screen capture of the page.  

I have heard of and personally seen cases of answers being edited later on the EWTN site.

--

Here is a capture I made to save everyone the trouble Smile




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holdencaulfield
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« Reply #13 on: March 27, 2008, 08:45:PM »

Long live Israel.
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St. Job
HMiS
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« Reply #14 on: March 28, 2008, 02:14:AM »

Quote from: holdencaulfield
Long live Israel.

Amen. Yes, I want the Catholic Church to live long.

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„Ja, Ja, wie Gott es will. Gott lohne es Euch. Gott schütze das liebe Vaterland. Für Ihn weiterarbeiten... oh, Du lieber Heiland!” ("Yes, Yes, as God wills it. May God repay it to you. May God protect the dear fatherland. Go on working for him... oh, you dear Savior!") - Clemens August Cardinal von Galen, his last words.


MagisterMusicae
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« Reply #15 on: March 28, 2008, 08:19:AM »

Quote from: HMiS
Quote from: SemperFidelis

Wow!  I can hardly believe an EWTN priest gave such a clear and concise, not to mention correct, answer on the Q & A forum.  Good for you Fr. Echert!

Neither can I believe this.

And he is correct. The current Jews are in unbelief, they are loved by God only because of their holy ancestors and Patriarchs, and they need to be converted. Modern Judaism is not even near Temple Judaism and the original Mosaic Law, but a rabbinical concoction from the Academy of Jamnia (90 AD).

Well, let's temper that a but HMiS. I agree completely with Father and with you, except that the Jews (of Hebrew origin or other) may be infidelis/perfidis (without the Faith) but they are human beings and the creation of God. It is not only because of the ancestors of the Hebrews (which all "Jews" cannot actually claim as ancestors), but also because they are human beings whose souls are eternal and whose souls He wants to save.

God loves the "Jews" so much that He wants them to convert and be redeemed by the Savior (some of) their ancestors put to death. He loves them enough that He is even willing to let them use their free will to choose Hell and give it to them (just like he does with us).

So, there's a bit more than just their ancestry involved here ... but not any more than with any other human beings.

Hence, while we can hate Zionism and the false Jewish religion and its mockery of Christ, a Catholic is not permitted to wish the damnation of any soul, including that of a Jew. One can point out that, without converting, objectively Zionism and the false Jewish religion will send a soul to Hell ("Do not Pass GO, Do not Collect $200").
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DaveC
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« Reply #16 on: March 28, 2008, 09:05:AM »

January 25, 1904: Herzl Finally Meets the Pope, but the meeting did not go well for him!

Herzl wrote in his diary that the Pope received him standing, and held out his hand, but Herzl refused to kiss it. Herzl also wrote in his diary  that the go-between Lippay had told him in advance that he must kiss the Pope's hand, but Herzl said he wouldn't do it. "I believe that this spoiled my chances with him, for everyone who visits him kneels and at least kisses his hand. This hand kiss had worried me a great deal and I was glad when it was out of the way". Herzl begun the meeting with the Pope by thanking him for the opportunity. Herzl put forth the request that brought him to seek audience with the Pope. But the Pope replied by saying:

 

"We are unable to favor this movement. We cannot prevent the Jews from going to Jerusalem - but we could never sanction it. The ground of Jerusalem, if it were not always sacred, has been sanctified by the life of Jesus Christ. As the head of the Church, I cannot answer you otherwise. The Jews have not recognized our Lord, therefore we cannot recognize the Jewish people. Jerusalem cannot be placed in Jewish hands."

Herzl then asked the Pope if he had any problem with the Holy land being under the control of the Muslims? The Pope relied:

"I know it is disagreeable to see the Turks in possession of our Holy Places. But we simply have to put up with it. But to sanction the Jewish wish to occupy these sites, that we cannot do."

However, Herzl attributed the Pope's answer due to Herzl's refusal to kiss the Pope's hand.

 

Herzl continued to plead with the Pope and told him that the Zionist movement was solely based on the suffering of the Jews, that that they were to push aside all religious issues.

 

The Pope replied that as the Head of the Church he could not allow it.  He said if he did, one of two things would happen.

 

'Either the Jews would retain their ancient faith and continue to await the Messiah whom we believe has already appeared - in which case they are denying the divinity of Jesus and we cannot assist them or else they would get there with no religion whatever, and then we can have nothing to do with them at all.'

 

The Pope also told Herzl that the Jewish faith had been superceded by the teachings of Christ and that 'we cannot admit that it enjoys any validity. The Jews who should have been the first to acknowledge Jesus Christ have not done so to date.' Herzl replied that terror and persecution were not the best methods to convert the Jews.

 

Herzl stressed that his Jewish people were under duress in Europe and that they desperately needed to acquire land out of Europe urgently. The Pope then asked Hertz why must it be Jerusalem? Herzl replied that he was not asking for Jerusalem but for the 'secular land' of Palestine. The Pope said he would not allow it. Herzl kept asking the Pope if he were aware of the condition of Europe's Jews and the Pope told Herzl that if the Jews came to Palestine that the churches and the priests would be ready and waiting for them to baptize them all.

 

We learn from Herzl's diary that his audience with the Pope lasted 25 minutes.

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In 2008, I'll vote for Ron Paul, or not at all!

رژیم صهیونیست بايد از صفحه روزگار محو شود

"Our own belief is that the renovation of the world will be brought about only by the Holy Eucharist."

    - Pope Leo XIII
holdencaulfield
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« Reply #17 on: March 28, 2008, 03:26:PM »

However I have to problem with the tolerant Jews ruling Israel. I would much rather the Jews rule Israel, then the Muslims rule it killing Christian pilgrims and desecrating our Holy Shrines.
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St. Job
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« Reply #18 on: March 30, 2008, 08:33:AM »

Yes it seems even God needs to tread softly when it comes to dealing with his chosen.......
 
It never ceases to amaze me how paranoid people are when it comes to discussing about issues with the "Jews",Christians,even Catholics,still believe there are two sets of rules that God has in dealing with his humanity and somehow he is desperately hoping that a certain religious/racial sect would please give him and his Son the worship he deserves.

What Chutzpa.
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To defend oneself, one must also be ready to die. There is little such readiness in a society raised in the cult of material well-being. Nothing is left, then, but concessions, attempts to gain time, and betrayal.
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In a time of universal deceit - telling the truth is a revolutionary act.
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DaveC
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« Reply #19 on: May 08, 2008, 08:39:AM »

The News also says you're a holocaust denier and anti-semite if you don't support the Zionist regime.
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In 2008, I'll vote for Ron Paul, or not at all!

رژیم صهیونیست بايد از صفحه روزگار محو شود

"Our own belief is that the renovation of the world will be brought about only by the Holy Eucharist."

    - Pope Leo XIII
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