Ecclesiasticus

[AnimaChristi]

I was reading the book of Ecclesiasticus (Sirach) in the Douay-Rheims Bible, but when I tried to compare some passages with newer versions (like the RSV-CE, Confraternity Bible, etc.) the passages were missing.  On further investigation I noticed that entire chunks of chapters are missing in the newer versions and in other parts don't even say the same thing in the newer versions that they say in the Douay-Rheims.

Explanations..?

[ONeill]

I was reading the book of Ecclesiasticus (Sirach) in the Douay-Rheims Bible, but when I tried to compare some passages with newer versions (like the RSV-CE, Confraternity Bible, etc.) the passages were missing.  On further investigation I noticed that entire chunks of chapters are missing in the newer versions and in other parts don't even say the same thing in the newer versions that they say in the Douay-Rheims.

Explanations..?

Make sure you are comparing the same book. (I once accidently was looking in Ecclesiastes for a verse in that book)

What particular verses don't match? I checked the D-R and the NAB and they seemed to match at first glance.

Sirach is not usually in non-Catholic Bibles.

[St_Josephs_Man]

Isn't there a discrepancy between the versing numbers in the DR and other Bibles? Or is that just in the Psalms?

[glgas]

I was reading the book of Ecclesiasticus (Sirach) in the Douay-Rheims Bible, but when I tried to compare some passages with newer versions (like the RSV-CE, Confraternity Bible, etc.) the passages were missing.  On further investigation I noticed that entire chunks of chapters are missing in the newer versions and in other parts don't even say the same thing in the newer versions that they say in the Douay-Rheims.

Explanations..?

Outside of the Psalms the most important differences between the Vulgata and the KJV are in the Ecclesiaticus (which is considered Apocripha in the KJV) but also there are significant discrepancies in Ezekiel, Daniel and also in some prophets.

I did not found reason for the differences, except that some parts of our Bible are not accepted by the protestants and the Jews

Traditionaly the Bible was divided into paragraphs, the chapters are 12th Century invertion, the verses are from the 17th Century.  Apparently the tradition for dividing is different for the Vulgata and KJV, the difference going back to the time of Septuaginta vs Masoretic text.

It is understandable why the protestants rejected the unity with the Catholics, but it is a stumbling block for me, why the Catholics decided for the protestant resolution, and why did so w/o careful explanation.

My only answer is, that a brand new religion the Judeochristianism rules the published world, from which either the Judaism and the Christianity is washed out, and for this process the confusion is necessary.

laszlo

[ONeill]

It is understandable why the protestants rejected the unity with the Catholics, but it is a stumbling block for me, why the Catholics decided for the protestant resolution, and why did so w/o careful explanation.

My only answer is, that a brand new religion the Judeochristianism rules the published world, from which either the Judaism and the Christianity is washed out, and for this process the confusion is necessary.

laszlo

I'm not sure what you are wondering. The numbering of verses does not matter and is only for convenience. The Jews use the Christian labels for the same reasons.

[glgas]

[

I'm not sure what you are wondering. The numbering of verses does not matter and is only for convenience. The Jews use the Christian labels for the same reasons.

In my world the communication, in this case the possibility of refer to  passages w/o restriction is important thing.

Also the context (the internal sequence of the verses) is important thing, and full passages are skipped, others relocated.

laszlo

[aquinas138]

My guess for the reason for the differences is that the Douay-Rheims is based on the Vulgate (and comparing it to the Septuagint), whereas modern editions like the RSV-CE also incorporate the evidence of the Hebrew versions discovered in the Cairo geniza and among the Dead Sea Scrolls, both of which were discovered in the 20th century and unavailable to the translators of the DR.  That said, the versification and chapter divisions of Sirach are different in almost every version - LXX, Vulgate, and the modern editions.  This is not totally explained by the Hebrew evidence, since even the modern editions vary in their versification.