Fish Eaters Traditional Catholic Forum
May 18, 2013, 04:11:AM *
Welcome, Guest. Please login or register.

Login with username, password and session length
News: The man still needs help!
 
   Fish Eaters    Forum Index   Forum Rules   Help Calendar Members Chat Room   Who's Chatting   Login Register  
Pages: [1] 2 3 4
 
Author Topic: French Swears  (Read 2136 times)
Credo
Member

Posts: 6,513



« on: March 25, 2009, 02:39:PM »

The below article is pretty interesting in a sociological sense, but pretty sad from a Catholic point-of-view. There are ten major things God clearly told us not to do. Only ten. Is respecting God, and things related to God, that hard to understand?
 


 
In French-Speaking Canada, the Sacred is Also Profane
(Source: http://www.religionnewsblog.com/16742/in-french-speaking-canada-the-sacred-is-also-profane)
 
MONTREAL — “Oh, tabernacle!” The man swore in French as a car splashed through a puddle, sending water onto his pants. He could never be quoted in the papers here. It is too profane.

So are other angry oaths that sound innocuous in English: chalice, host, baptism. In French-speaking Quebec, swearing sounds like an inventory being taken at a church.

English-speaking Canadians use profanities that would be well understood in the United States, many of them scatological or sexual terms. But the Quebecois prefer to turn to religion when they are mad. They adopt commonplace Catholic terms — and often creative permutations of them — for swearing.

In doing so, their oaths speak volumes about the history of this French province.

“When you get mad, you look for words that attack what represses you,” said Louise Lamarre, a Montreal cinematographer who must tread lightly around the language, depending on whether her films are in French or English. “In America, you are so Puritan that the swearing is mostly about sex. Here, since we were repressed so long by the church, people use religious terms.”

And the words that are shocking in English — including the slang for intercourse — are so mild in Quebecois French they appear routinely in the media. But not church terms.

“You swear about things that are taboo,” said Andre’ Lapierre, a professor of linguistics at the University of Ottawa. In the United States, “it is not appropriate to talk about sex or scatological subjects, so that is what you use in your curse words. The f-word is a perfect example.

In Canadian French, you have none of the sexual aspects. So what do you replace it with? You replace it with religion. If you are going to use a taboo word, it would be anything related to the cult, to Christ, the Communion wafer, Jesus Christ, vestments, and elements of the altar like tabernacle. There’s quite a few of them.”

Visitors from France are dumbfounded at that use of French, said Lamarre. “But that’s because they got away from domination of the church a long time ago. They cut off the head of the king really early. We didn’t do that.”

The Catholic Church was overwhelmingly dominant in Quebec from early in the province’s history — England’s King George III gave the French Catholic clergy enormous power in 1774, in part to counter the growing American insurgency to the south. In the “Quiet Revolution” of the 1960s, Quebecers rebelled. They “just stopped going to church one Sunday,” as Lamarre put it.

The swearwords have persisted even though church attendance has plummeted in the past 40 years. Because of that drop, “when the young kids on the street are swearing, they don’t even know what they are swearing about,” mused Monsignor Francis Coyle, pastor of St. Patrick’s Basilica in Montreal. “They’re baptized in church, and that’s about it.”

Last spring, the Montreal Archdiocese commissioned an advertising campaign that erected large billboards in the city intended to shock and educate. Each billboard featured a word like “tabernacle” or “chalice” — startling swearwords on the street — and offered the correct dictionary definition for the religious term. Such as: “Tabernacle — small cupboard locked by key in the middle of the altar” containing the sacred goblet.

“The point was to try to get people not to use the terms too glibly,” Coyle said.

The campaign ended, but Lapierre said Quebecers continue to use the words in highly inventive ways — as expletives, interjections, verbs, adverbs and nouns. One could say, for example, “You Christ that guy,” to mean throwing a person violently. “I don’t know any other language that does that so well,” he said.

The French here also modify the oaths into non-words, depending on the level of politeness desired. The word “bapteme” — baptism — is used as a strong oath, but a modification, “bateche,” is milder. The sacramental wafer, a “host” in English and “hostie” in French, can be watered down to just the sound “sst” in polite company. “Tabernacle” can become just “tabar” to avoid too much offense.

The oaths are so ingrained that one cannot converse fluently without them, said Lapierre. “I teach them in my class.”

Logged

I promise not to put anything here which might help us question our mind-forged manacles, inspire us, or help us in any way at all.

N.B.: I will not be posting on this site again until the Christmas octave. Have a good Advent.
DrBombay
Quintessential Heckler
Member

Gender: Male
Location: Undisclosed
Posts: 9,660



« Reply #1 on: March 25, 2009, 02:51:PM »

"...we were repressed so long by the church..."

I've got a few scatalogical references I could throw at this dumb broad.  Luckily for her I'm a Catholic gentleman. 

Logged

There are known knowns. These are things we know that we know. There are known unknowns. That is to say, there are things that we know we don't know. But there are also unknown unknowns. There are things we don't know we don't know.
Robhaidheuch
Member

Posts: 265


« Reply #2 on: March 25, 2009, 02:55:PM »

French  f@#k%+s! I'm no gentleman.

Logged

Alba na bragh! (Scotland Forever)
libby
Member

Gender: Female
Location: Southeast USA
Personality type: INFP
Posts: 5,873


"does this bike make me look fat?" - VoxClamantis


« Reply #3 on: March 25, 2009, 02:58:PM »

that's ridiculous... they say all of those things because it feels good to blaspheme...
 
one could say " gosh, ow " when one stubs their toe, or one could say "&^%$^#!#!!!!@@@!!!!"
 
The latter gives you some sense of control over the situation, and makes you feel better.
 
As for the Europeans being dumbfounded because they settled the issue years ago?
 
shyeah..... my cousins in Spain used to say " host" ....I would ask them repeatedly what they meant by that, because I thought it meant the Eucharist.
 
They simply said "It does."
 
I didn't get it.... and this was back when they were good Catholics...;)
Logged
libby
Member

Gender: Female
Location: Southeast USA
Personality type: INFP
Posts: 5,873


"does this bike make me look fat?" - VoxClamantis


« Reply #4 on: March 25, 2009, 03:10:PM »

The French here also modify the oaths into non-words, depending on the level of politeness desired. The word “bapteme” — baptism — is used as a strong oath, but a modification, “bateche,” is milder. The sacramental wafer, a “host” in English and “hostie” in French, can be watered down to just the sound “sst” in polite company. “Tabernacle” can become just “tabar” to avoid too much offense.

The oaths are so ingrained that one cannot converse fluently without them, said Lapierre. “I teach them in my class.”

[/QUOTE]

as far as conversing fluently, that's ridiculous...that's like saying a comedian can't be truly funny unless he's cussing his head off.... just stupid.

If you have a least half a thought in your head, you should be able to use talent and intelligence to get your thoughts across.

Modifying the words:

Yep - well.

I agree that many people still think that sex is taboo...thus, the liberal use of the "f" word.

Cubans and Spaniards.... well,  have a thing about defecation.

So, I remember when I was little, my father's words:

" I defecate on the world."

" I defecate on sh**." ( I guess that was a double whammy there)

" I defecate on so- and -so's mother."

etc.....

The one I didn't get was defecating on the number ten.

"Diez" is ten.

"Dios" is God.

.......so, at least he stuck to the number rather than the Real Thing.

:(


Logged


ONeill
Member

Posts: 890


« Reply #5 on: March 25, 2009, 03:18:PM »

Irish curses are the best; they are actual curses.

Maltese curses are most profane in everyway... They shocked even me.

The Middle East however has an obsession with animals and Jews in their curses. A translation of a very vulgar exchange is quite funny; it is more like a zoological list.

I disagree with the author though. Curses have many sources, usually related to culture. A donkey is not particularly taboo in the middle east, but to be called one is offensive. Sort of throws a chip in the author's statements. 

Logged

This account is left over from the forum database transfer. It was once deleted, but the backup database used to create this new forum had it active.
libby
Member

Gender: Female
Location: Southeast USA
Personality type: INFP
Posts: 5,873


"does this bike make me look fat?" - VoxClamantis


« Reply #6 on: March 25, 2009, 03:29:PM »

Quote from: ONeill

Irish curses are the best; they are actual curses.

Maltese curses are most profane in everyway... They shocked even me.

The Middle East however has an obsession with animals and Jews in their curses. A translation of a very vulgar exchange is quite funny; it is more like a zoological list.


Cubans do real curses too.... " Cursed be the day that blah blah blah."
 
"cursed be the woman who gave birth to you." Or, you could always defecate on her.
And if you're really angry, on the woman who bore the woman who gave birth to you.
 
Multi - generational insults....these are best for traffic vents.
 
 
Many times the persons or things being cursed are just left blank - fill in as needed:
 
"Maldito sea.........."
 
I'll have to think of others... many times I was left speechless by the intricate masterpieces uttered by the men in my family.
 

 
I don't think we would have used the "F" word on anyone... that's such a grand thing to do, why waste it on someone you're fighting with?!
 
Smile
Logged
maso
Member

Posts: 1,108


« Reply #7 on: March 25, 2009, 03:59:PM »

This claim that the Church repressed so much the Quebec people to explain the swears with religious words is ridiculous. What then about the Spanish swears?

Logged
AlanF
34 Fishies.
Member

Gender: Male
Location: Surrey, England
Posts: 619



« Reply #8 on: March 25, 2009, 04:55:PM »

Quote from: Credo
In the “Quiet Revolution” of the 1960s, Quebecers rebelled. They “just stopped going to church one Sunday,” as Lamarre put it.


Uh huh....

It all just came together.
Logged

All the mumblings of Popery.
libby
Member

Gender: Female
Location: Southeast USA
Personality type: INFP
Posts: 5,873


"does this bike make me look fat?" - VoxClamantis


« Reply #9 on: March 25, 2009, 05:06:PM »

Quote from: maso

This claim that the Church repressed so much the Quebec people to explain the swears with religious words is ridiculous. What then about the Spanish swears?


.........got ya covered there, maso.
Logged
Pages: [1] 2 3 4
 
 
Jump to:  

Powered by SMF 1.1.8 | SMF © 2006-2008, Simple Machines LLC