Anyone have references for point by point explanation of Westminster Confession?

[iglesiadomestica]

Hi
I am in a bit of a jam and need resources.  Here is the situation:

I am a Catholic Home school mom and belong to a few home school groups.  One is completely Catholic and the 2 others are mixed Christian denominations.  The rule in the mixed group is that we not discuss denominations and respect by not entering in debates on doctrines so basically we keep topics on homeschooling and engage in general prayers not specific to any particular denomination.  For years this has worked great.  This year we had some issues that were offensive to all in particular a dance performance that was given by one home school teenager that was highly sexual and caused scandal.  Then another parent member held a seminar and in it he used quotes from L. Ron Hubbard and claimed Hubbard was a greatest thinker and recommended the reading of Dianetics.  This group requires the signing of a decree of faith that states you believe Christ to be the our Savior therefore a member of Scientology, which this person then gave knowledge of being, is not supposed to be given membership.  In the process of some members trying to get the association to do something with regards to this situation it came to light that there are other members that practice faiths contrary to Christianity like Yoruba (not sure if that is how it is spelled or said in English).  The groups leadership has decided to leave things as they are and not address any of these issues further and even reprimanded the parties that asked for action accusing them of not being charitable and attempting to cause division.

Because of this these families decided to start another group that they want to actually adhere to the Christian values.  Some of the families are good friends of ours from home schooling though they are not Catholic.  They called us to invite us to a meeting and  see what we think.  Everything seemed great until they asked us to read the Westminster Confession of Faith and said this would be their faith decree for the group.  I had never read it but knowing that it was written by the reformers I certainly suspected what I found.  I obviously cannot be a member of a group that holds that to be true no doubt in my mind and no need to debate on that aspect.  However because they are good friends and there is a loving friendship relationship involved, besides knowing them to be of good intention and simply indoctrinated in erroneous beliefs since childhood, I do want to give a clear explanation as to why this document goes against Christian faith and not simply leave it to them to think that Catholics are not really Christian because we don't believe in this document kwim? 

However I am no theologian and do not have the necessary training for apologetic debate.  They are well-educated and trained in their faith so they have some strong preconceived notions which they will likely debate I am sure but I am also certain they can be reasoned with but even if not I want to try and educate them as to my faith and make it clear that all our doctrines are Christian.  I know I need documents that better explain the errors of the points in this Confession of Faith to help me with my limitations.  Does anyone have an article or document that thoroughly explains all the points in the Westminster Confession of Faith that are not in accord with the Catholic-Christian faith and why?  Preferably written to Protestants.

Thank you in advance for any help.

God Bless

[Vetus Ordo]

Westminster Confession? I've never heard of it. I'll have to look it up.

[iglesiadomestica]

Prepare yourself it is not a pleasant read.  Long and infuriating at points.

JMJ

[SouthpawLink]

iglesiadomestica,
You should avoid non-Catholic homeschool groups, especially those that actively promote heresy. As to the first group you mentioned, I'm curious as to the content of the "decree of faith." Surely, Our Lord Jesus Christ is the Savior, but He is also the Second Person of the Blessed Trinity. I wonder if the faith decree mentions that at all.

The second group, which promotes the Westminster Confession of Faith - is one you should not participate in.

Very quickly, here are some errors of the Confession:

Chapter I (Of the Holy Scripture) - "The infallible rule of interpretation of Scripture is the Scripture itself: and therefore, when there is a question about the true and full sense of any Scripture (which is not manifold, but one), it must be searched and known by other places that speak more clearly."

- This article repudiates the teaching authority of the Church, and the chapter as a whole rules out the unwritten word of God, viz. Divine Tradition.

Chapter III (Of God's Eternal Decree) - "By the decree of God, for the manifestation of His glory, some men and angels[6] are predestinated unto everlasting life; and others foreordained to everlasting death."

- If here it is suggested that God has created men for the purpose of sending them to hell, then it is a heretical statement. Double-predestination was condemned at the Second Council of Orange (in A.D. 529).

Chapter XI (Of Justification)... read Session VI of the Council of Trent to see why this chapter is false.

Chapter XVI (Of Good Works) - "Works done by unregenerate men, although for the matter of them they may be things which God commands; and of good use both to themselves and others... they are therefore sinful and cannot please God."

- This opinion was condemned by Pope St. Pius V in Ex Omnibus Afflictionibus (n. 35; 1 October 1567).

Chapter XXV (Of the Church) - "There is no other head of the Church but the Lord Jesus Christ. Nor can the Pope of Rome, in any sense, be head thereof; but is that Antichrist, that man of sin, and son of perdition, that exalts himself, in the Church, against Christ and all that is called God."

- Do I need to point out the obvious error here? 

Chapter XXVII (Of the Sacraments) - "There are only two sacraments ordained by Christ our Lord in the Gospel; that is to say, Baptism, and the Supper of the Lord"

- False because, on the contrary, Our Lord instituted seven sacraments: Baptism, the Holy Eucharist, Confirmation, Penance, Extreme Unction, Holy Orders and Holy Matrimony.

Chapter XXXI (Synods and Councils) - "All synods or councils, since the apostles' times, whether general or particular, may err; and many have erred. Therefore they are not to be made the rule of faith, or practice; but to be used as a help in both."

- To suggest that general (ecumenical) councils may err - in defining doctrine - is simply heretical, and it is also false to say that they cannot be considered as the rule of faith.


Here is the Westminster Confession of Faith online: http://www.reformed.org/documents/wcf_with_proofs/

[iglesiadomestica]

Hi
Like I said I am clear on not wanting or being able to participate in a group that holds to this Confession of Faith.  I fully understand all of the heretical statements in it.  And while the points you mention are all true and clear to me I fear those explanations will not go far with Protestants that have been taught these ideas as biblical and Christian.  Which is why I want a further more biblical explanation for them since they are not yet in place to be receptive to this.  I have seen such explanations on Sola Fide and Sola Scritura but not a deconstruction of this Confession of Faith.  I guess I could just give them the ones on those points but I would also like to address the statement on the Pope and others which I don't have any documentation on.

As for the other non-Catholics groups I disagree because if as a Home schooler I only go to Catholic groups our socialization would be extremely limited.  There aren't many home schoolers here and many are not Catholic.  We must be in the world while not of the world and there is no way to be salt and light if you close yourself in to only your own kind.  There is also no way to evangelize or love your fellow brethren if you reject them by not being willing to be around them.  The world is full of non-Catholics and even Catholics that are not adhering or understanding the faith sometimes even promoting erroneous doctrines.  I have been more offended by Catholics that promote inadvertently certain ideas very contrary to our faith like pro-choice or sterilization than by many Christians of other denominations.  Point is that we must learn to live with and deal with these people while keeping our faith and values and in the process planting the seeds with hopes that it may help lead others to Christ and his true church.

As for that groups decree of faith it is not that specific it is very open in that respect but it also does not say anything contrary to that belief.

JMJ

[Vetus Ordo]

If you want to educate yourself more on the Protestant errors, try this page:

http://www.protestanterrors.com/

It's very good.

[Ray M Facere]

If this group of people respects you as much as you respect them, then it should be sufficient to say there are many things in the Westminster Confession that as a faithful Catholic you cannot accept, therefore, it would be impossible for you to join a group who takes this confession as its basis. I suspect that if you simply left it at that, it would be best.

Because they are so entrenched in their own Protestant faith, they are unlikely to be responsive even to arguments which accept their false premise (i.e., arguments that start out using Scripture to prove Catholic dogma). However, if you did want Scriptural proofs for the Papacy, Justification and other things mentioned there are plenty available on www.scripturecatholic.com

If you wanted to pursue this, the only possible course that I could see would be have your friends accept a Catholic confession as the basis for the group. I think anything short of that might be a problem, even a compromise solution which accepts for instance, the Apostles Creed as its basis would need to carry the proviso that the Catholic interpretation of this Creed was to be used as the basis.