Theology of Clothing (not a modesty debate)

[James02]

Why??  Do you have an argument against it?

No, not at all.  It is just this thread has morphed into a ladies fashion thread, and probably should be moved to "about women".  I don't have anything to contribute, except....

I thought that was what aprons were for- so you could wear nicer clothes and not get them dirty. 

Wrong.  Aprons were designed to bring your husband to his knees.  Aprons are hot. 

[violet]

Why??  Do you have an argument against it?

No, not at all.  It is just this thread has morphed into a ladies fashion thread, and probably should be moved to "about women".  I don't have anything to contribute, except....

Maybe we just need a man to LEAD us back to the topic.  You know how distracted us women folk can get.   

[James02]

It sounds like your question is answered.  If it deals with you in particular, then yes you can dress as you describe.  And to care to dress well and present a good image of a Catholic is a good thing.

As far as discussing styles for women in general, I don't think that it is possible.  Women are too varied by age and body type.  A 50 year old lady who had eight kids will dress differently than a 25 year old single woman.

The Catholic Church has its framework.  You operate inside of that, and it is fine.  I do think that we must beware of Jansenism, but where I go to Mass, that has not been a problem.  People are pretty much normal Catholics.

[violet]

It sounds like your question is answered.  If it deals with you in particular, then yes you can dress as you describe.  And to care to dress well and present a good image of a Catholic is a good thing.

As far as discussing styles for women in general, I don't think that it is possible.  Women are too varied by age and body type.  A 50 year old lady who had eight kids will dress differently than a 25 year old single woman.

The Catholic Church has its framework.  You operate inside of that, and it is fine.  I do think that we must beware of Jansenism, but where I go to Mass, that has not been a problem.  People are pretty much normal Catholics.

Other than wanting to avoid Jansenism, I think we ought to direct our attention to how the outside world sees us. 

[James02]

To win converts.

To oppose sloth.

But you can't be overly concerned about it.  Still, Catholics should present themselves well to the world.  Now there are obviously much higher priorities.  Living a charitable life, receiving the sacraments, avoiding sin, etc...  But we should dress well for Mass.  In the same vein, but to a lesser degree, we should dress well for work.  Or when we go out shopping.  It has to do with beauty, goodness, and order.  These are good things from God.

[James02]

When you are rushing to Mass with a bunch of little kids, it is a wonder some time that you even remember to put all your clothes on!

I look at dressing well as a laudable goal.  You look at pictures for the early 20th century how dirt poor laborers dressed and it puts us to shame.  So it can be done.  But again, it is lower on the priority list than the other things I mentioned.  And vanity is something to avoid.   We just have to stay balanced as Catholics.

[Dust]

Well first, I'd say (if the ladies will let me) that, as some people have already said, styles and tastes aren't an issue here, but rather, modesty by Church teaching.  I thought many of the outfits violet posted were funny looking and/or not classy at all, but modest, sure.  (The exception would be this one: http://1.bp.blogspot.com/_6q_LjQm1vKc/TRkoWzRK90I/AAAAAAAABLs/-1tORBXdspQ/s1600/IMG_9214.jpg ...classy and even pulled off those darn high boots well... but I digress.)  Our differences in taste aside, this was one post I could wholeheartedly agree with:

I try (sometimes fail) to dress slightly more "plain" for Sunday Mass than I do in regular life.  So I might wear semi-formal solid colored dress with plain black flats, while if I were going out grocery shopping I might wear vibrant colors, jewelry, funky shoes, etc. 

My reasons are because I see mass as the one place where you do not want to call attention to yourself because it might distract peoples focus.

I have found that my approach is opposite of most peoples. 

We have to remember Mass isn't about us.  Making a point of having "church clothes" is a good idea, IMO.  Not required by any stretch, but it helps us get in the proper frame of mind. I will sometimes dress slightly better for work on days I will be stopping at Mass on the way home.  Not my "Sunday clothes" but a little step up from my typical work attire. 

Being considerate of others by not drawing attention is a great idea too, and one that I would point to as an important part of being modest at Mass.  There are clothes that I make a point of not wearing to church also, on account of this same distraction factor that Violet mentioned.

All this said, I understand that every shepherd has the right to institute rules for how his flock should dress (however strict or loose) though that may not always be wise, IMO.  I do not believe I have never frequented a church that posted a dress code prominently, though not because I was avoiding any I just never saw one at any churches I've gone to repeatedly.  I could have been blindly missing them too...

[violet]

Well first, I'd say (if the ladies will let me) that, as some people have already said, styles and tastes aren't an issue here, but rather, modesty by Church teaching.  I thought many of the outfits violet posted were funny looking and/or not classy at all, but modest, sure. 

Hey...it can be tricky to find pictures of modest and trendy clothing. Beggars can't be choosers.  You are welcome to do better! 

[violet]

To win converts.

To oppose sloth.

But you can't be overly concerned about it.  Still, Catholics should present themselves well to the world.  Now there are obviously much higher priorities.  Living a charitable life, receiving the sacraments, avoiding sin, etc...  But we should dress well for Mass.  In the same vein, but to a lesser degree, we should dress well for work.  Or when we go out shopping.  It has to do with beauty, goodness, and order.  These are good things from God.

Agreed. I think there is some responsibility to be the kind of people that others admire or recognize as more diligent and thoughtful.

Do I dress well everyday?  No.  But the days I do I notice a difference in how I feel and how I behave.  I also notice a difference in how people react to me. 

I think these details matter.  They are the little sacramentals of everyday life.

[The_Harlequin_King]

Hey...it can be tricky to find pictures of modest and trendy clothing. Beggars can't be choosers.  You are welcome to do better! 

This thread turned into a henhouse fast. Yawn.

Any image of myself is an example of modest and classy attire for men. Probably. Usually. As for the wimmins..... *shrug* The posted images aren't to my liking, but, whatever. Modest and trendy are both largely subjective.  Especially the trendy part. If you like Victorian, neo-Vic or steampunk, I recommend perusing my thread on Dickens on the Strand for some good ideas.

BTW, I am currently looking for a really nice dress for a wedding & not having much luck.  For that, I would like something really elegant.

I'm rather partial to this green one. I'd post it as an image if it weren't so huge.