Phillipus Iacobus
Blue Fish
Gender: 
Posts: 11,297
|
|
« Reply #150 on: February 03, 2012, 08:20:PM » |
|
Does any sound moral theologian say anything on the issue? Prümmer, Jone, McCallan & Hugh?
I do think that as it is a gateway drug, it should be avoided. Cigarettes are the real gateway drug. If we are to look at the real numbers, I think you'll find that to be the case. We do not need a "sound moral theologian" to address a specific plant. Its effects, and the general principles are enough. We are not puritans, though, so I don't think it is intrinsically, per se evil or "bad."
We do need the Church to examine the issue. We, as laity, have no authority to decide on these matters. And that is a misuse of the word "puritan". It does not mean what you think it means. |
|
|
|
|
Logged
|
|
|
|
kgreen
Member
Gender: 
Personality type: sanguine-melancholic
Posts: 126
|
|
« Reply #151 on: February 03, 2012, 09:43:PM » |
|
I was always told in school that nicotine was more addictive than heroin and crack combined. I don't know if that's true or not, but that's what they told us. With regard to driving after marijuana, prescription narcotics have the same potential as do sleeping medications. Not only that, but sleeping medications also can cause the person taking them to wake up during their sleep, basically sleep walking, not know that they're doing it, and walk around doing all kinds of weird stuff. This could include driving, then imagine the trouble. I have seen a close member of my own family do this after taking sleeping pills. She has been taking them every day for about 15 years, so it is not something that her body is just trying to adjust to. Also, these are highly habit-forming. If you want to take arguments like that, you can't do much of anything. A billboard of a scantily clad woman may distract some and cause them to drive off the road, we do not outlaw those. For some people it may be a dog in their car that suddenly jumps on their lap and bumps the steering wheel. There's no law against animals in the car.... I could go on for a while with examples of how pretty much anything could cause a car accident in many circumstances. Anyway, I don't really agree with recreational use either, been there done that. But there are medicinal uses for cannabis. Also, if it was legalized and regulated, the street pot wouldn't have as much of a market, meaning less crime, less people in jail that your tax dollars are paying for. Marijuana probably is a gateway drug, I really believe for a lot of people it is. But if you take away the mystery, it might not be as desired as it is now. For example, smoking cigs when you're young is so much "cooler" (in the eyes of the one doing it) than smoking when you're older. The same can be said for getting alcohol when you're young as opposed to going out to the bar when it's legal. There is not the thrill of getting caught, of doing something rebellious.
|
|
|
|
|
Logged
|
|
|
|
Grasshopper
Gold Fish
Gender:
Location: Madison, WI, USA
Posts: 1,409
|
|
« Reply #152 on: February 04, 2012, 01:02:PM » |
|
I do think that as it is a gateway drug, it should be avoided.
I smoked marijuana regularly for years (I gave it up along with cigarettes about 8-1/2 years ago, but smoked both for many years before that), and never felt the slightest temptation to try anything "harder". Drugs like LSD and heroin and cocaine scared the crap out of me then, and still do now. I wanted nothing to do with any of them. I realize that this is only one piece of "anecdotal" evidence, and proves nothing. But I think if marijuana is a gateway drug, it is only because it's illegal, and therefore puts you in touch with the people who deal with illegal drugs in general. If it was legal and regulated, it wouldn't be any more of a gateway drug than cigarettes or alcohol -- and no more inherently evil than either of those. |
|
|
|
|
Logged
|
|
|
|
Mithrandylan
Banned for promoting sedevacantism
Regular
Gender:
Location: Tundra
Personality type: Melancholy- a point below phlegmatic
Posts: 10,141
Divínum auxílium ✝ maneat semper nobíscum.
|
|
« Reply #153 on: February 04, 2012, 04:38:PM » |
|
I do think that as it is a gateway drug, it should be avoided.
I smoked marijuana regularly for years (I gave it up along with cigarettes about 8-1/2 years ago, but smoked both for many years before that), and never felt the slightest temptation to try anything "harder". Drugs like LSD and heroin and cocaine scared the crap out of me then, and still do now. I wanted nothing to do with any of them. I realize that this is only one piece of "anecdotal" evidence, and proves nothing. But I think if marijuana is a gateway drug, it is only because it's illegal, and therefore puts you in touch with the people who deal with illegal drugs in general. If it was legal and regulated, it wouldn't be any more of a gateway drug than cigarettes or alcohol -- and no more inherently evil than either of those. Yes. And pot simply isn't a gateway drug. There is nothing to support that claim. If you think the numbers of people who've smoked pot and then later shot smack are incriminating, you should see how many people who use heroin drank milk as young teens. It's a post hoc, at best. |
|
|
|
|
Logged
|
|
|
|
LoneWolfRadTrad
Sheepdog in wolf's clothing
Member
Gender:
Location: Living in the New World Order/Anti-Christendom but not of the New World Order/Anti-Christendom
Personality type: A sinister kid, the boy with the broken halo... :P usually accused of being a comedic/outgoing/charming/laid back guy. Too laid back in the eyes of most, they wouldn't believe I have a temper. You'd have to do alot to get me angry.
Posts: 1,691
Too often seeing red.
|
|
« Reply #154 on: February 04, 2012, 05:20:PM » |
|
I do think that as it is a gateway drug, it should be avoided.
I smoked marijuana regularly for years (I gave it up along with cigarettes about 8-1/2 years ago, but smoked both for many years before that), and never felt the slightest temptation to try anything "harder". Drugs like LSD and heroin and cocaine scared the crap out of me then, and still do now. I wanted nothing to do with any of them. I realize that this is only one piece of "anecdotal" evidence, and proves nothing. But I think if marijuana is a gateway drug, it is only because it's illegal, and therefore puts you in touch with the people who deal with illegal drugs in general. If it was legal and regulated, it wouldn't be any more of a gateway drug than cigarettes or alcohol -- and no more inherently evil than either of those. Yes. And pot simply isn't a gateway drug. There is nothing to support that claim. If you think the numbers of people who've smoked pot and then later shot smack are incriminating, you should see how many people who use heroin drank milk as young teens. It's a post hoc, at best. Or used hard drugs, but smoked tobacco or drank alcohol before they were old enough to legally have either. ANYTHING is a gateway drug, if it is illegal TO YOU. |
|
|
|
|
Logged
|
When you go up to receive communion, you're literally at the foot of the cross. Standing at all creation's center, the saints gather around. Martyrs, heroes staring into your very being. They lived AND died for Christ... can we say the same of ourselves? What are WE doing to further God's will in this life? Skipping Mass for our careers? Our education? Voting for heads of state, that don't recognize the source of all authority and power? They won't matter on your deathbed (or whatever end we meet).
So... why waste time with this modern world's nonsense? We have our own civilization: CHRISTENDOM. We must restore it whilst the modern world commits societal suicide.
Its naive and idealistic to believe government for man by man can succeed. Restore Christendom in our hearts and homes! Communities aren't that far off, its a numbers game.
"Accursed is the man that puts his trust in man" Book of Jeremiah Chapter XVII, verse 5.
|
|
|
|
|
Mithrandylan
Banned for promoting sedevacantism
Regular
Gender:
Location: Tundra
Personality type: Melancholy- a point below phlegmatic
Posts: 10,141
Divínum auxílium ✝ maneat semper nobíscum.
|
|
« Reply #155 on: February 04, 2012, 05:49:PM » |
|
I do think that as it is a gateway drug, it should be avoided.
I smoked marijuana regularly for years (I gave it up along with cigarettes about 8-1/2 years ago, but smoked both for many years before that), and never felt the slightest temptation to try anything "harder". Drugs like LSD and heroin and cocaine scared the crap out of me then, and still do now. I wanted nothing to do with any of them. I realize that this is only one piece of "anecdotal" evidence, and proves nothing. But I think if marijuana is a gateway drug, it is only because it's illegal, and therefore puts you in touch with the people who deal with illegal drugs in general. If it was legal and regulated, it wouldn't be any more of a gateway drug than cigarettes or alcohol -- and no more inherently evil than either of those. Yes. And pot simply isn't a gateway drug. There is nothing to support that claim. If you think the numbers of people who've smoked pot and then later shot smack are incriminating, you should see how many people who use heroin drank milk as young teens. It's a post hoc, at best. Or used hard drugs, but smoked tobacco or drank alcohol before they were old enough to legally have either. ANYTHING is a gateway drug, if it is illegal TO YOU. If there is a gateway drug, it's either alcohol or tobacco. The gateway drug theory came around the seventies because somewhere near 90+ percent of people who had done hard drugs like opiates or cocaine had done pot first, but it did not account for those who used pot and never used hard drugs. In other words, it's like saying because 100% of fatal car crashes are preceded by driving a car, driving a car kills you. It's just simply not so. |
|
|
|
|
Logged
|
|
|
|
Phillipus Iacobus
Blue Fish
Gender:
Posts: 11,297
|
|
« Reply #156 on: February 04, 2012, 08:55:PM » |
|
As everything stands right now, and how marijuana is (such as how it effects the brain) would anyone here right now advocate to legalize it? Or must it be weakened? If legalized, who would be allowed to smoke it?
|
|
|
|
|
Logged
|
|
|
|
DrBombay
Quintessential Heckler
Member
Gender:
Location: Undisclosed
Posts: 9,719
|
|
« Reply #157 on: February 04, 2012, 09:02:PM » |
|
As everything stands right now, and how marijuana is (such as how it effects the brain) would anyone here right now advocate to legalize it? Or must it be weakened? If legalized, who would be allowed to smoke it?
Yes, legalize it. Anyone stupid enough to want to smoke it should smoke it. Whatever. |
|
|
|
|
Logged
|
There are known knowns. These are things we know that we know. There are known unknowns. That is to say, there are things that we know we don't know. But there are also unknown unknowns. There are things we don't know we don't know.
|
|
|
LoneWolfRadTrad
Sheepdog in wolf's clothing
Member
Gender:
Location: Living in the New World Order/Anti-Christendom but not of the New World Order/Anti-Christendom
Personality type: A sinister kid, the boy with the broken halo... :P usually accused of being a comedic/outgoing/charming/laid back guy. Too laid back in the eyes of most, they wouldn't believe I have a temper. You'd have to do alot to get me angry.
Posts: 1,691
Too often seeing red.
|
|
« Reply #158 on: February 04, 2012, 09:22:PM » |
|
As everything stands right now, and how marijuana is (such as how it effects the brain) would anyone here right now advocate to legalize it? Or must it be weakened? If legalized, who would be allowed to smoke it?
Yes, legalize it. Anyone stupid enough to want to smoke it should smoke it. Whatever. Legalize it. The drug cartels would lose their monopoly on their cash crop. There goes most of their funding. And there goes the cash crop for drug dealers and gangs. Organic producers would sell marijuana in a form untainted by drug dealers (drug dealers ADD HEAVY DRUGS to their weed). We'd also have it as a safer alternative to alot of pain medications. |
|
|
|
|
Logged
|
When you go up to receive communion, you're literally at the foot of the cross. Standing at all creation's center, the saints gather around. Martyrs, heroes staring into your very being. They lived AND died for Christ... can we say the same of ourselves? What are WE doing to further God's will in this life? Skipping Mass for our careers? Our education? Voting for heads of state, that don't recognize the source of all authority and power? They won't matter on your deathbed (or whatever end we meet).
So... why waste time with this modern world's nonsense? We have our own civilization: CHRISTENDOM. We must restore it whilst the modern world commits societal suicide.
Its naive and idealistic to believe government for man by man can succeed. Restore Christendom in our hearts and homes! Communities aren't that far off, its a numbers game.
"Accursed is the man that puts his trust in man" Book of Jeremiah Chapter XVII, verse 5.
|
|
|
Phillipus Iacobus
Blue Fish
Gender:
Posts: 11,297
|
|
« Reply #159 on: February 04, 2012, 09:25:PM » |
|
Ok. Right now, would it be morally licit/permissible for a Catholic to smoke marijuana for recreational purposes? Medicinal purposes?
|
|
|
|
|
Logged
|
|
|
|
|
