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Author Topic: The fewness of the saved!  (Read 5776 times)
NihilNominis
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Brothers, when shall we begin to do good?


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« Reply #80 on: May 31, 2012, 02:09:AM »

It's probably wise to entertain good hope and holy fear at once.  Best to avoid both presumption and despair.
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Alleluia, alleluia, alleluia:
Laudate Dominum omnes gentes, laudate eum omnes populi:
quoniam confirmata est super nos misericordia ejus,
et veritas Domini manet in aeternum.
Gloria Patri et Filio et Spiritui Sancto:
sicut erat in principio et nunc et semper et in saecula saeculorum.  Amen.
Alleluia, alleluia, alleluia.
StrictCatholicGirl
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« Reply #81 on: May 31, 2012, 11:00:PM »

So many people say we should only talk about the nice things, and ignore the dark, sober things, so as not to lead people to despair. They imply that people are so delicate and sensitive, that the Truth will crush their spirit. In my own personal experience, that is not true. The times that I have thought of the Catholic life as easy, I have gone from mortal sin to mortal sin. The times I have read sobering texts, like The Fewness of the Saved, and Letter from Beyond, and the like, I have exerted much more effort to resist temptation, and persevered longer in a state of grace.

Not true for me. I'm one of those delicate spirits easily crushed. Fear was never a motivator for me to do good. I like the old Irish/Celtic spirituality, what I mean is, the old St. Patrick kind. Joyful in its approach to the natural world, not concentrating on the fewness of the saved, but on the Trinity and the goodness of creation. That's the legend, anyway.   
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"We are afraid of God's surprises." -- Pope Francis
Scotus
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« Reply #82 on: June 01, 2012, 11:24:AM »

I think at different times we can be either crushed or spurred on by the thought that the number of the saved is relatively few. At those times we are depressed or struggling in our faith it is better (I think) to refrain from books and articles that we know will cause us anxiety and concentrate on God's infinite mercy. However, when we feel more robust it is no bad thing to turn our thoughts to God's infinite justice and how narrow is the path that leads to Life.
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"[L]et no man, how sinful soever he be, despair, so long as he liveth, of the infinite mercy of God; inasmuch as there is not a tree in the world so twisted and knotted and gnarled but may be fashioned and polished and beautiful by the hand of man; so likewise there is no man in this world so wicked and so sinful but God can convert him, and adorn him with singular graces and many gifts of virtue." - Br Giles (The Little Flowers of St Francis of Assisi)
StrictCatholicGirl
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« Reply #83 on: June 01, 2012, 12:27:PM »

I will never be spurred on by the thought that the saved are few and the damned are many. Never. I don't care how theologians interpret the texts...in my opinion Jesus was speaking about the Pharisees in those scripture passages, not about people in general. In Revelations, there is a number in heaven "too great to count." Wow.. the manyness of the saved!
« Last Edit: June 01, 2012, 12:49:PM by StrictCatholicGirl » Logged

"We are afraid of God's surprises." -- Pope Francis
JoeVoxxPop
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« Reply #84 on: June 01, 2012, 02:39:PM »

Um
Narrow is the way and FEW are they who find it. JESUS
Many are called but FEW are chosen JESUS
I rest my case.
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StrictCatholicGirl
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« Reply #85 on: June 01, 2012, 02:47:PM »

After this I looked and there before me was a great multitude that no one could count, from every nation, tribe, people and language, standing before the throne and in front of the Lamb. They were wearing white robes and were holding palm branches in their hands. (Revelation 7:9)

I rest my case.
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"We are afraid of God's surprises." -- Pope Francis
Vetus Ordo
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« Reply #86 on: June 01, 2012, 03:24:PM »

After this I looked and there before me was a great multitude that no one could count, from every nation, tribe, people and language, standing before the throne and in front of the Lamb. They were wearing white robes and were holding palm branches in their hands. (Revelation 7:9)

I rest my case.

That passage only establishes that the number of the elect will indeed be great. We can only wonder at God's bountiful mercy! However, it doesn't establish that the number of the elect is greater than the number of the reprobate. You're trying to read that in the text but it's not actually there.

In fact, Christ intimates very clearly - not just to the Pharisees or to His own disciples - but to all the Christian audience throughout the centuries that few will indeed find the strait way that leads to heaven. In other words, the analogy is that the gate of damnation is large and the gate of eternal life is narrow. It's not merely a description that the life of holiness is hard and the life of debauchery is easy, that is obvious enough, but a divine insight into how much of mankind will indeed be lost. Does this mean that the reprobate will outnumber the elect? We don't know and, frankly, it's a worthless speculation. What we do now is that mankind is lost and that if it were not for God's mercy, we all would be damned.
« Last Edit: June 01, 2012, 03:28:PM by Vetus Ordo » Logged

"THE LORD is my light and my salvation, whom shall I fear? The Lord is the protector of my life: of whom shall I be afraid?" (Psalm 26:1)

"And we, too, being called by His will in Christ Jesus, are not justified by ourselves, nor by our own wisdom, or understanding, or godliness, or works which we have wrought in holiness of heart; but by that faith through which, from the beginning, Almighty God has justified all men; to whom be glory for ever and ever. Amen." — Clement, bishop of Rome

"I love truth," says he, "and not sects. I am sometimes a peripatetic, a stoic, or an academician, and often none of them; but—always a Christian. To philosophise is to love wisdom; and the true wisdom is Jesus Christ. Let us read the historians, the poets, and the philosophers; but let us have in our hearts the gospel of Jesus Christ, in which alone is perfect wisdom and perfect happiness." — Petrarch
Scotus
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« Reply #87 on: June 01, 2012, 04:18:PM »

I will never be spurred on by the thought that the saved are few and the damned are many. Never. I don't care how theologians interpret the texts...in my opinion Jesus was speaking about the Pharisees in those scripture passages, not about people in general. In Revelations, there is a number in heaven "too great to count." Wow.. the manyness of the saved!

Of course, I do not mean that we actually rejoice that the greater number of people effectively choose not to enter into the Beatific Vision. I mean that the thought of the relative fewness of the saved in comparison to the lost can act as a spur to pray and do penance for our sins and those of others.

But, the fact is, not everybody finds such a reflection salutary and it can become a source of dread and anxiety. I have felt like that at times as well. Especially at the times I have struggled with aspects of the faith. In that case it's best to "pray, hope, and don't worry", as Padre Pio said.
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"[L]et no man, how sinful soever he be, despair, so long as he liveth, of the infinite mercy of God; inasmuch as there is not a tree in the world so twisted and knotted and gnarled but may be fashioned and polished and beautiful by the hand of man; so likewise there is no man in this world so wicked and so sinful but God can convert him, and adorn him with singular graces and many gifts of virtue." - Br Giles (The Little Flowers of St Francis of Assisi)
nmoerbeek
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« Reply #88 on: June 16, 2012, 04:59:PM »

"Christ died for sinners; we must take heart, therefore, and hope that Paradise will be ours, provided only we repent of our sins, and do good." St Philip Neri
source
http://en.wikisource.org/wiki/The_maxims_and_sayings_of_St_Philip_Neri

Have Hope in Jesus, he desires your salvation more than you do!
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shin
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« Reply #89 on: June 17, 2012, 07:02:AM »

I have always had special hope in the Green Scapular, and the regular recital of its prayer for one's family.


'Nature and grace cannot subsist together in the same heart. The one must always make room for the other.'

St. Margaret Mary Alacoque
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