Strange views for a Catholic.

[Adam Wayne]

Kreeft equivocates "universalism" -- all men are saved?  Religious indifference or religious indifferentism?  There's a distinction.  Of course he is wrong.  Catholics flock to the false religions for several reasons, but mostly perhaps they are lacking in informed conscience.  Also, Protestantism promises an easy way to salvation, you hardly have to do anything.  Just believe and your are saved.  And once saved, these won't hinder you from attaining your heavenly reward.  Catholics who are well informed in their conscience know how difficult it is to attain salvation.  Jesus did not undergo His terrible Passion and death to make it easy for us.  Yes, He paid the ransom for sin, but that did not take us away from sinning anymore.  And losing our salvation.

How true. Although I cannot comment on Kreeft's viewpoints that you have espoused as I did not listen to the lecture. But, what I have bolded in your post, theirin lies the rub.

Not many well informed Catholics around these days I am afraid.

Another reason that a deal with the SSPX is of importance.

I've got somewhat of a soft spot for this man because I read his book on Angels and on the reason for our cultural rot. Can't recall it's name but he mentions demonic influence. Everyone is at different levels and even Father Corpai helped people come back to the Faith. Sham that he now appears to have been.

[Vetus Ordo]

Also, Protestantism promises an easy way to salvation, you hardly have to do anything. Just believe and your are saved.  And once saved, these won't hinder you from attaining your heavenly reward.

That's not exactly true.

For Protestant theology, good works are the fruits of a saving faith. So while it's faith alone that justifies a man before God, it's not a faith devoid of works.

What about what Luther said about mortally sinning 1000 times a day?

I'm not aware of it, although I'd venture to say that a man who sins mortally 1000 times a day is certainly not regenerate.

I was just reproducing what, at least, classical Protestant theology says about the relationship of faith and works.

[Scriptorium]

I think I heard this lecture before. 

It's akin to being in the desert, deciding to leave the oasis and drink from the mirage.  Notice, that in all of this it's the "movement of the spirit" and not the work of the devil? 

Well, I wished to show how the "movement of the spirit" works. It would be downright heresy to say God does not work through false religions. Do you attempt to limit His power and presence? All that needs to be qualified is that He works through them to draw those people to Himself, and to His Church. Just as God permits evil and makes good of it, He permits false religions, and people to make the free choice to join them, that good may come of it. But this is a far cry from saying that these bodies are the one Body of Christ. But as for my life, since I put a little out there, Satan was present, and working. During those years I denied the existence of God. I attempted to lead others into this error, including Catholics. I thought that Christianity was a nice religion, but ultimately inefficacious. I took refuge in the Buddha, the Dharma, and the Sangha, thereby officially adopting a false religion. I engaged in many sins of the flesh in that period because of the room within their moral system to rationalize away the moral code (no objective standard). So, yes, Satan was present. I did evil works based on his voice in my ears. And Christ worked through this too, because I realized very acutely that Buddhism did not have all the remedies to my ailments. The Buddha as physician did not have all the remedies. And it seemed to me that there was a note in my heart saying, "You need to see another physician for a second opinion."

While I despise the evil of my past, and have laid that at Christ's feet through confession, I do not look at my time astray as ultimately regrettable. I regret sin. But really I was never ready for traditionalism. And my life has taken that path. It was a very fruitful time for me, and there were many good people I knew and learned from that primed me for hearing that message a little before Trinity Sunday in 2002. This is very subjective, but Peter Kreeft understands that path many people take. Maybe because we've been around a lot of people who have lost the Faith, or doubted it, that we can maybe empathize with them. Since I hold Christ is more powerful than Satan, the workings of Satan related to one who converts or comes back to the Faith I hold as naught. Christ is victor. Sin has been conquered. Now for those still in those situations, Satan has a hold, and I pray for them. We can make ourselves worthy messengers so that they to may respond to the call.

[Vincentius]

Also, Protestantism promises an easy way to salvation, you hardly have to do anything. Just believe and your are saved.  And once saved, these won't hinder you from attaining your heavenly reward.

That's not exactly true.

For Protestant theology, good works are the fruits of a saving faith. So while it's faith alone that justifies a man before God, it's not a faith devoid of works.

I was just reproducing what, at least, classical Protestant theology says about the relationship of faith and works.

The classic retort of the Protestant in reply to the Catholic reference to the Epistle fo St. James ("faith without works is dead") and St. Paul (1 Cor 13:13):  "[13] And now there remain faith, hope, and charity, these three: but the greatest of these is charity.":  is Romans 3:27  "Where is then thy boasting? It is excluded. By what law? Of works? No, but by the law of faith. 28 for we account a man to be justified by faith, without the works of the law."   By the way, Luther in his translation of the Bible in German added the word alone after "faith."

I have debated, discussed, argued with Protestants (including the well respected Albert Mohler, Pres. of the Southern Baptist Seminary, who attacked Mary in one of his essays), and they are of the same mind and thought about salvation:  faith only, though they disagree on other theological teachings based on the Scriptures, yet they swear by the Bible as the only means to be saved.

Here is a classic onset of an argument:    ""You  need to know that salvation is FREE GIFT and that you cannot work for it,  buy it,  go to church for it,  or be good enough for it .  It is absolutely FREE!"   The Bible says in Ephesians 2:8-9,  "For by grace are you saved through faith;  and that not of yourselves:  it is the gift of God:  Not of works,  lest any man should boast."

Huge error in that statement, which gives false hopes.  Catholics who are not well-versed in their catechism (especially nowadays where the clergy and prelates are teaching social justice, and like stuff, but never about salvation) are easily persuaded by these statements and go for it hook line and sinker.  Who wouldn't?   The Bible says so.  Of course, the quote from the Scriptures are only those that agree with what they would like to believe.   All else is to be disregarded.   Whatever happened to St. Paul's admonishment "with fear and trembling work out your salvation"?   That is never quoted and St. John Chapter 6 is skipped altogether.

[Phillipus Iacobus]

No sin will separate us from the Lamb, even though we commit fornication and murder a thousand times a day.

[jacobhalo]

And God has allowed this because God is a good father.  And a good father would rather see his children go away from home and live, than stay home and die.

That's nonsense and a complete error. You can't leave the Catholic Church (home) and "live". There is no salvation in false religions. There is no life and sanctifying grace in these false sects.

  Not according the Pope John Paul II.  According to him, all religions can gain salvation.  You wonder why the Catholic church finds it hard to convert people?  Why convert if the path to God can be gained through  any religion?  The pope taught a false teaching.  Jesus said the only way to the father is through me. 

[Scriptorium]

Not according the Pope John Paul II.  According to him, all religions can gain salvation.

Where did he say that?


Authentic quotes?

Pope John Paul II " The mystery of salvation is continued and accomplished in the Church, and from
this single source it reaches the whole world. There is no salvation outside the Church. From her
alone there flows the life giving force destined to renew the whole of humanity, directing every human
being to become a part of the Mystical Body of Christ."
Losservatore Romano Oct.12,1981

Pope John Paul II "There is no entering into salvation outside of the Church, just as in the time of
the Deluge there was none outside the Ark which denotes the Church."
Wanderer May 4, 1992

[Pilgrim]

Not according the Pope John Paul II.  According to him, all religions can gain salvation.

Where did he say that?


Authentic quotes?

Pope John Paul II " The mystery of salvation is continued and accomplished in the Church, and from
this single source it reaches the whole world. There is no salvation outside the Church. From her
alone there flows the life giving force destined to renew the whole of humanity, directing every human
being to become a part of the Mystical Body of Christ."
Losservatore Romano Oct.12,1981

Pope John Paul II "There is no entering into salvation outside of the Church, just as in the time of
the Deluge there was none outside the Ark which denotes the Church."
Wanderer May 4, 1992

But...but...he's a post Vatican II pope!  He can't be a good Catholic! 

 

[Papist]

Not according the Pope John Paul II.  According to him, all religions can gain salvation.

Where did he say that?


Authentic quotes?

Pope John Paul II " The mystery of salvation is continued and accomplished in the Church, and from
this single source it reaches the whole world. There is no salvation outside the Church. From her
alone there flows the life giving force destined to renew the whole of humanity, directing every human
being to become a part of the Mystical Body of Christ."
Losservatore Romano Oct.12,1981

Pope John Paul II "There is no entering into salvation outside of the Church, just as in the time of
the Deluge there was none outside the Ark which denotes the Church."
Wanderer May 4, 1992

But...but...he's a post Vatican II pope!  He can't be a good Catholic! 

 

Ha! Thank you for this!

[Vincentius]

No sin will separate us from the Lamb, even though we commit fornication and murder a thousand times a day.

[/quote

I recall that he also said something about "sin boldly" (or sin often) in a letter to Melanchton.