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Author Topic: Was Mary Magdalene a whore?  (Read 1923 times)
Sophia
Guest
« Reply #10 on: August 17, 2005, 09:37:PM »

Telling him about traditional teachings is useful, but more-so to publish like you did what it his based on.

 

I'm not telling him I'm telling you.  Perhaps it is a language problem.

 

Your coming out of left field with the Da Vinci Code. What does it have to do with anything?

 

I am responding to what Dominus Tecum said about the liberal trend to reduce the greatness of Mary Magdalene as well as eclipse other Church traditions in the name of political correctness.  Since the Da Vinci Code is about Mary Magdalene, it is relevant to discuss how it and things like it are harming the truth about her.  It strikes me that the same people who buy into the Da Vinci Code are the same people who insist upon political correctness and scholarly accuracy.   I had no idea that you were a fan of the Da Vinci Code.

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Vandaler
Guest
« Reply #11 on: August 17, 2005, 09:56:PM »

Quote
I'm not telling him I'm telling you.  Perhaps it is a language problem.

If there has been a language problem, it may have been my use of the term "folklore".  It might have been stronger then I intended.   

 

Quote

I am responding to what Dominus Tecum said about the liberal trend to reduce the greatness of Mary Magdalene as well as eclipse other Church traditions in the name of political correctness.  Since the Da Vinci Code is about Mary Magdalene, it is relevant to discuss how it and things like it are harming the truth about her.  It strikes me that the same people who buy into the Da Vinci Code are the same people who insist upon political correctness and scholarly accuracy.   I had no idea that you were a fan of the Da Vinci Code.

Gotcha, quite appropriate then.  I had written in the "Introduce yourself" section that I quite liked the Da Vinci Code yes... I thought you where picking on that.

 

 

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Montreal_Marisa
Member

Posts: 730


« Reply #12 on: August 17, 2005, 11:07:PM »

Quote from: Vandaler
This is your personal experience... You can't read to much into certain contacts or conversation you had.  I see no pre or post-VAT II teachings here. Quite frankly, it's not conclusive anyway. Where do you get confirmation that she was a prostitute in this post?  Certainly HMiS seems to think so, but where does he find his certainty other then through a tought process. Certainly no hard facts.  She was a Sinner (not sure what a "deep" sinner his) that Christ embraced, thats all we know for sure.


It's only my personal experience as far as I was laughed at and made fun of because I believed what my mother taught me about Mary Magdalen.  Had I learned anything in the post Vat II Church about her, it surely would have been a watered down politically correct version of things, as we see today.

The point in mentioning my mother was that it has always been a Catholic tradition that Mary Magdalen was a whore and repented her sins.  This is what the Church taught, and my mother learning it before modernism entered the Church is proof of that.  The Church prior to Vatican II was the same everywhere with the exception of the Eastern rite (if I'm wrong someone please correct me!).  You could walk into a Catholic Church virtually anywhere in the world and get the same Latin Mass that was said on the other side of the world.  You would get the same catechism everywhere, virtually the same traditions with minor differences. That is not the situation today.  Many priests, bishops, laymen, etc. today, make changes based on their fancy, to be politically correct, to appease other religions, to make the rainbow people happy, to make women happy, some new and "improved" "scholar" said so, etc etc etc.  Even John Paul II did it.  When something isn't consistent it's hard to know what to believe.  I'll rely on what is consistent about the Catholic Church, and to do that I have to go back to pre-VatII.  

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Vandaler
Guest
« Reply #13 on: August 18, 2005, 06:27:AM »

Well, I did learn... or at least I gather from the posts that there has been a Church tradition that conveyed her has a prostitute. Has anyone some text of an official nature that says that?  I'd be interested to read how it goes.

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Marybonita
Member

Posts: 948


« Reply #14 on: August 18, 2005, 07:29:AM »

There is quite a bit known and accepted as valid tradition about the Magdeline. She was a well-known and flagrant woman of the streets but rather upper-class. Compare her to call-girls rather than a street prostitute perhaps. Her conversion was public and it was spectacular. She came from the depths of sin - a daughter of Satan - to the heights of glory - a daughter of God.

She was sister to Lazarus and Martha. After the dispersion of the Apostles and the real persecution by the Jews had begun against the followers of the Nazarene as the Christ was called, she, along with Lazarus and Martha was expelled from Israel and travelled to Gaul. (France) Lazarus became a Bishop, Martha helped him in his ministry while the Magdeline retreated to a cave on a remote island and lived out the remainder of her days doing penance. The relics of Lazarus, Martha and Mary were extant until the French revolt of 1789 which resulted in the destruction of many such important relics.

But the real mystery may be her role in the "stoning" episode.  It is believed that she was set up by the Pharisees to entrap Jesus Christ along the same lines as the coin of Kaizer. The Pharisees would get rid of a notorious and public sinner and also attack the orthodoxy of Jesus Christ by asking Him another question on the Law of Moses. It was win-win as they say. (The man was not accused - just Mary)

What exactly did Christ write in the sand? He may have exposed their plot. Or He may have accused them of more sinister activities such as the cult of Mithra or the Kabbala. It is certain that He did not write ordinary sins such as stealing or lying. They were serious enough to have the participants flee.

And, yes Marisa, your mother understood exactly what I was taught through the Catholic schools pre VII: the Magdeline was a public sinner. This is a charitable phrase for prostitute. It's actually more charitable than consigning her to a shop girl and denying her sin which of course reduces the impact of her conversion on the public mind.

Imagine the frustration of the Pharisees in all this.

In JMJ
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Jesus, Mary, I love you, save souls!


AdoramusTeChriste
Dances with Chopper

Member

Posts: 5,677



« Reply #15 on: August 18, 2005, 07:49:AM »

Quote from: Vandaler

Well, I did learn... or at least I gather from the posts that there has been a Church tradition that conveyed her has a prostitute. Has anyone some text of an official nature that says that?  I'd be interested to read how it goes.

Not everything taught by the Church is contained in some form of official text. That's the same sort of argument used by Protestants to deride the Mass, the Sacraments, and the Immaculate Conception. Tradition is part of the Deposit of Faith.

 

I would be interested in reading something written about her by, for example, a St. Augustine or a St. Jerome; something that takes the gospel and elaborates the way a good homily does. Know what I mean?

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Jarrod_D
Member

Posts: 787


« Reply #16 on: August 18, 2005, 08:16:AM »

Quote
there are many stories of St. Nicholas that may or may not be true.

 

My favorite story is that at the first ecumenical council St. Nicholas punched the heretic Arius.  My kind of SAINT!

 

Re: Mary Magdalene

 

The Catholic encyclopedia suggests that the word used for  Magdalene is a Talmudic expression for "woman with curly hair," which I guess meant prostitute.

 

re: Davinci Code

 

I was watching a show on the DaVinci Code and their main premise was "Jesus took Mary Magdalene as his wife, the Church hates women so they 'turned' Mary Magdalene into a whore."

 

Only problem with that is ... the Catholic Church considers Mary Magdalene to be a Saint.  Go figure.

 

Jarrod

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

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Vandaler
Guest
« Reply #17 on: August 18, 2005, 08:17:AM »

Quote

Not everything taught by the Church is contained in some form of official text. That's the same sort of argument used by Protestants to deride the Mass, the Sacraments, and the Immaculate Conception. Tradition is part of the Deposit of Faith.

 

I would be interested in reading something written about her by, for example, a St. Augustine or a St. Jerome; something that takes the gospel and elaborates the way a good homily does. Know what I mean?

I perfectly know what you mean... This is why I'm interested in reading an actual exemple of this teaching... Evaluate it's authority sort to speak. There might be a perception I'm some kind of deconstructionist and trying to damage tradition... not at all.  I'm just looking to find what kind of authority this subject had in the past.

 

 

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Montreal_Marisa
Member

Posts: 730


« Reply #18 on: August 18, 2005, 08:23:AM »

Quote
This is a charitable phrase for prostitute. It's actually more charitable than consigning her to a shop girl and denying her sin which of course reduces the impact of her conversion on the public mind.


That is my take on it as well.  If she was just a shop owner, what's the impact about her conversion, her salvation through Christ?  Why would she be mentioned in the Bible in the first place if there weren't a miracle surrounding her conversion?

Contrary to politically correct thought that paints the Church as degrading to women by saying "looky here, Magdalen was no whore, she was just your average shop keeper, see what the Church did to her good name!  Those eeeevil Catholics!"...the fact that Magdalen was a public sinner and that she was forgiven, gives the rest of us poor sinners hope that we may also be forgiven our sins if we repent.  
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Jarrod_D
Member

Posts: 787


« Reply #19 on: August 18, 2005, 08:37:AM »

Quote

If she was just a shop owner, what's the impact about her conversion, her salvation through Christ?

 

Either way the Bible does say that Jesus cast several demons out of her.  Her story is still one of conversion ... just from what?

 

Jarrod

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