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Author Topic: Le Pen Has Displeased the Masters Again  (Read 928 times)
VoxClamantis
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« on: December 02, 2005, 10:14:PM »

From the European Jewish Press:
 
 
Le Pen to be sued over gas chamber statements  
By David Dahan Updated: 30/Nov/2005 16:53

 
 
 
French anti-racist organizations are planning to sue Jean-Marie Le Pen, the French extreme-right party leader after he again dismissed the Nazi gas chambers as “a detail”.
 
Le Pen made the renewed comments during an interview on the BBC’s Hardtalk show which focused on the recent riots in France’s suburbs.
 
He had originally caused anger amongst Jews and anti-racism campaigners alike when he first made a similar comment in 1987.
 
 
Mere detail
 
During the one-on-one interview Stephen Sackur, the show’s host, recalled that less than a year ago Le Pen “described the Nazi occupation of France as ’not particularly inhuman’" and “the holocaust as a mere detail of history,”
 
Le Pen jumped to his own defence. "That’s not the same thing. No, I didn’t say that. I shall tell you exactly what I said. I said the gas chambers were a detail of the history of the World War," he replied.
 
"And this is true. None of the leaders - Churchill, Roosevelt, Stalin or De Gaulle - ever mentioned the gas chambers in their memoirs," the far right leader added.
 
In 1987, Le Pen stated on RTL radio that the Nazi gas chambers were "detail of WWII history." At the time he was condemned by a French court to pay a 183,200 euros fine, because of the mistake he made in "trivializing" the persecutions perpetrated by the Nazis.
 
 
Racist tendancies
 
Speaking about immigrants in France and their difficulties of finding jobs, Le Pen pointed out that "these people have a reputation for being fairly incompetent in work, being aggressive, and often being hostile.”
 
Le Pen added that there was no need of being "surprised to find that employers tend not to recruit them, in preference to people of French descent."
 
When Sackur replied to him that when he would "say things like that it’s not hard to see why a majority in France see you as a racist and an Anti-Semite."
 
 
Scandalised
 
SOS Racisme, UEJF, the French Union of Jewish Students, the Licra, the International League against Racism and Anti-Semitism, and the MRAP, the Movement against Racism and for Friendship among the peoples sued Jean-Marie Le Pen for maintening his gas chambers comments being a "detail of WWII history."
 
"We are scandalized, it is unbelievable that the leaders of the Front National continue to declare that gas chambers are just a detail of history," Marilou Jampolsky, SOS Racisme spokesperson told EJP.
 

Quote
Um, OK, then they're "not a detail of History." Is that better? What thought must we have about this detail, er, matter? What if we just think that it's a "detail" but don't tell anyone? Or what if we just write it in our diaries? What if we mumble the words "they are a detail of History" in our sleep? What if we say that, but then immediately follow up with "Just kidding!" 

 
"The fact that it is a repeat offence and that he had been condemned in the past for such statements, this affaire will go quicker and the condemnation will be heavier," she added.
 
Quote
He has been a very naughty boy!

 
"Le Pen confirms and validates the anti-Semitic and revisionist nature of the Front National. These statements are not only extremely grave but they were held abroad in order to avoid the French legislation and to send a European message to all the revisionists in Europe," Mouloud Aounit, the MRAP Chairman said.
 
 
BBC response
 
Bridget Osborne, Hardtalk producer told EJP that the BBC did not want to do a sensationalist show, "we interviewed Le Pen because he was the second most important candidate in France during the 2002 presidential elections," she said.
 
"I do not see the difference between saying ’the Holocaust was a detail of history’ and saying that ’gas chambers was a detail of history’," she added.
 
Quote
Either way, off with his head!

 
"Through the interview, Stephen tried to show the inconsistency of Le Pen rhetoric and I think he has done a pretty good job."
 
On Tuesday, the French socialist party expressed its "indignation" in regard to Le Pen’s gas chambers statement.
 
Contacted by EJP, the CRIF, the French Jewish umbrella organization, refused to comment on Le Pen statement, "in order not to give him publicity."
 
Quote
Look, Le Pen obviously is suffering from the "virus of antisemitism." How can he help himself?! Do we torture people with AIDS or SARS? 
  

Meanwhile, I remind you that you can say ANYTHING -- even the grossest, most obvious lie -- about Jesus Christ and His Church. You can make movies about it, write books about it, air your nonsense of publicly-funded television. You can be sacrilegious and blasphemous. You can say Mary Magdalen was Our Lord's love toy. But what you can not do is say "it was 3 million, not 6" or that "the 'Holocaust' was just a detail of History, one horrible episode of violence among many episodes of violence." Think about that.

 

Bottom line: they want post-Temple Jews to be seen as "the suffering servant." They want to replace Christ as the focal point and centerpiece of History. Getting you to believe this is the very heart of the use of the "antisemite" slur. It is a matter of dogma.

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HMiS
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« Reply #1 on: December 03, 2005, 05:44:AM »

1. I think Le Pen´s  statements were unwise. On top of that: the extermination of the Jews during WW II is and remains a fact, even if abused by Jewish - especially zionist - organisations!

 

2. Lepen´s children and grand children were baptized in churches of the........SSPX.

 

3. I agree the reaction is exaggerated, but nevertheless we should not accept Le Pen´s unwise statements.

 

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„Ja, Ja, wie Gott es will. Gott lohne es Euch. Gott schütze das liebe Vaterland. Für Ihn weiterarbeiten... oh, Du lieber Heiland!” ("Yes, Yes, as God wills it. May God repay it to you. May God protect the dear fatherland. Go on working for him... oh, you dear Savior!") - Clemens August Cardinal von Galen, his last words.
DominusTecum
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« Reply #2 on: December 03, 2005, 11:45:AM »

Please, please tell me how these statements were unwise?

 

Are they not true? The Holocaust® is just as much a "detail of history" as is the June 6, 1944 Normandy beach landings, or the firebombing of Dresden, or any of these other things. There is absolutely NO LIE or even a DECEPTION in saying that the "holocaust" is a "detail of history." It is. Le Pen is merely stating the facts there. If he cannot speak the truth for fear of displeasing the Jewish holocaustian power base, then what is the morally correct thing to do? Should he just shut up about it and not say anything, or should he say what is true? It is ridiculous to just "not comment" on the Jewish persecutions in WWII for fear of making certain people mad, and it is even more ridiculous to lie. He would be in no trouble whatsoever if he DID stretch the facts, and said "The Holocaust® was THE CENTRAL event in WWII, far surpassing all others in importance." That twisted idea of history is what is being preached today, and Le Pen is to be much admired for standing against it. He didn't even say anything too inflammatory. Imagine if he'd said "There were no gas chambers." He'd be arrested in a millisecond. Instead, he said "They were a detail of history." I would think this would be seen as anti-Revisionist, actually, rather than revisionist. The PC-Jewish advocacy organizations are out for Le Pen's blood, and they WILL have it. This is just a pretext.

 

 

 

 

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francis
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Posts: 372


« Reply #3 on: December 04, 2005, 12:13:AM »

Quote
Meanwhile, I remind you that you can say ANYTHING -- even the grossest, most obvious lie -- about Jesus Christ and His Church. You can make movies about it, write books about it, air your nonsense of publicly-funded television. You can be sacrilegious and blasphemous. You can say Mary Magdalen was Our Lord's love toy. But what you can not do is say "it was 3 million, not 6" or that "the 'Holocaust' was just a detail of History, one horrible episode of violence among many episodes of violence." Think about that.

 Bottom line: they want post-Temple Jews to be seen as "the suffering servant." They want to replace Christ as the focal point and centerpiece of History. Getting you to believe this is the very heart of the use of the "antisemite" slur. It is a matter of dogma.



It is disturbing. I could say, "Mao never killed 70 million. It was only 30 million," and no-one would care. But to speak dismissively of the Holocaust is not just seen as ignorance or insensitivity but as a criminal blasphemy. It is a matter of dogma. Think how an old-time inquisition would have treated some-one who maintained that Christ did not truly suffer, and you can predict the fate of those who "trivialise" the holocaust.

Holocaust (complete sacrifice) of Jews.  
Resurgence of Jews and establishment of Israel.

Perfect Sacrifice of Christ.
Resurrection of Christ and establishment of Church (new Israel.)
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Deogratias
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Posts: 682


« Reply #4 on: December 04, 2005, 02:11:AM »

Quote
The Holocaust®

 

lol

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mattc
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Posts: 694


« Reply #5 on: December 04, 2005, 10:51:AM »

Is there no protection of speech outside of the US?
 
 I can't believe someone could get sued for that.  Or *arrested*?
 
 And why is it only comments about Jews get you in hot water?
 
 Europe has become a very strange place.
 
 
 
 
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And another angel came, and stood before the altar, having a golden censer; and there was given to him much incense, that he should offer of the prayers of all saints upon the golden altar, which is before the throne of God.  And the smoke of the incense of the prayers of the saints ascended up before God from the hand of the angel.

The Apocalypse of Saint John 8:3-4
Varus
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« Reply #6 on: December 05, 2005, 04:20:AM »

Europe is a leftist tyranny. Things are bad in many ways in the US too, but you can still hold an opinion and articulate it. Over here in Europe, in some countries, however, you are not even allowed to merely have the "wrong" opinion. I am a prison officer here in Norway. The biggest prisons here are full of foreigners. (Mostly Moslems). That is a plain fact. But you cannot say it when you are in training (prison school), because  the school authorities could find out and then  you might be put on a list consisting of people who "might hold views not in conformity with the values adhered to by the prison service." If you are pro capital punishment (which we don't have anyway), you are deemed "unfit" for the job. Why is that? I mean, we don't have it anyway?

-It's because you are thereby deemed to be capable of holding other "evil" views, such as anti-immigration, more severe punishment et al, in short, you are assumed to be "intolerant". Therefore you will be thrown out.

 

This is not the way it is in general society in Norway, but in Sweden you would find it to be full-blown. They have Berufsverbot for people in academia, public service etc. This is like 1984, believe me!

 

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VoxClamantis
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« Reply #7 on: December 05, 2005, 04:42:AM »

Quote from: mattc
Is there no protection of speech outside of the US?

I can't believe someone could get sued for that.  Or *arrested*?

And why is it only comments about Jews get you in hot water?

Europe has become a very strange place.

 

It's not just a European problem. Ernst Zundel was kidnapped from his home in Tennessee, taken to Canada where he was kept in solitary for two years, then deported to Germany where he sits in prison for "Holocaust denial." Germar Rudolf was extradited from the US to Germany to be imprisoned for "Holocaust denial." There will be many more.

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HMiS
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Posts: 6,172



« Reply #8 on: December 05, 2005, 09:29:AM »

Sweden, Norway and Danmark are the root of leftist-liberal political correctness, and along with the Netherlands (and the Communist block) they were the first to illegally "permit" abortions on a massive scale. While in Danmark and - partly in Norway (give feedback, Varus!) - some kind of new sanity is getting in, this leftist liberal tyranny is gradually conquering Austria, has since 1960 conquered Western Germany and is now in the process of totally uniformizing political thought in Spain, Switzerland and the new EU state.

 

In fact, I think, that Great Britain might be quite a comfortable place to live in. Criticizing destability by immigrant expansion is allowed there, and some conservative notes are tolerated.

 

Most definitely the Netherlands and France are not, I fear. Over here you will be forced to abdicate if you criticize "reproductive rights" (that is: the abortion slaughter mills) etc. Though I think we might be approaching a lash back on the liberal left establishment in future. The present "new" parties are merely focused on anti-Islamism, and not aware of the greater threats to Dutch society, like aging, population diminishing, ghettos and moral collapse.

 

But time will come.

 

I think Lepen just tried to "please" the French secular right by these statements: Marshall Pétain is loved by them and after all until the start of the Jew deportations he was an ally of Nazi Germany. Catholic Right Wing in France is more focused upon State-Church relationship, the Monarchy (Vive le Roi. Dieu et le Roi!) and morality issues.

 

I personally like Bruno Mégret more than Lepen. Lepen might have had his children baptized by SSPX priests, but he is not a real Roman Catholic himself, at least as far as I know. Then I mean: my standards of being Roman Catholic, that is: practising.

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„Ja, Ja, wie Gott es will. Gott lohne es Euch. Gott schütze das liebe Vaterland. Für Ihn weiterarbeiten... oh, Du lieber Heiland!” ("Yes, Yes, as God wills it. May God repay it to you. May God protect the dear fatherland. Go on working for him... oh, you dear Savior!") - Clemens August Cardinal von Galen, his last words.
Varus
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My old avatar is back!


« Reply #9 on: December 18, 2005, 06:17:AM »

Sorry for replying so late, but I did not see it until now...

 

Abortion was allowed on the late 70's here in Norway, but we still have relatively low numbers. The region I live in, the southwest, has the lowest in the country. This is also the region were a high percentage of people (compared to, for instance, the Oslo area), when they have a choice between "safe" sex and no sex, in stead of using contraceptives, abstain.

 

You are quite right, HMiS, that Denmark (in particular), but also Norway, is regaining some sanity in many areas. Denmark is a member of the EU, but resists many of the EU decrees. The general opinion in Denmark is anti-EU now and has been for a long time. We also see a huge growth in Conservative blogs and groups, after many years in the desert.

 

In Denmark, the Danish People's Party is really big and they are against the EU, against immigration and the Eurabian menace and favour the traditional farmers against massive industrial food production. They are also staunchly pro-monarchy. (The Danish Crown Prince, Frederick, is a man after my taste. He is a military man, explorer (Greenland expedition) and said last year that "the Danish farmer is the very backbone of our country. He always answered when his King summoned him for service. Now, in this terrible time for agriculture, We will answer his call and pay Our debts.")

I wonder why this man is not Catholic....

 

If the Catholic Church in Denmark had been less modernist, it could have attracted thousands of Lutherans. The Danish state church is irrelevant today and it is very liberal, but you have some ministers who are really conservative politically. (Søren Krarup, who is active in the DPP)

 

As for Norway, we have the Progress Party on the right wing. It is our best option here and very anti-immigration. The downside is that it is not outspokenly anti-abortion, that isleft to the individual politician since there is no chance to abolish abortion here. Only one party is, but it is pro-multiculturalism and everything else. It also pushes gender-equality a lot.

 

Is there any signs of recovery in Holland and Belgium? What about Vlaams Belang?

 

 

 

 

Quote from: HMiS

Sweden, Norway and Danmark are the root of leftist-liberal political correctness, and along with the Netherlands (and the Communist block) they were the first to illegally "permit" abortions on a massive scale. While in Danmark and - partly in Norway (give feedback, Varus!) - some kind of new sanity is getting in, this leftist liberal tyranny is gradually conquering Austria, has since 1960 conquered Western Germany and is now in the process of totally uniformizing political thought in Spain, Switzerland and the new EU state.

 

In fact, I think, that Great Britain might be quite a comfortable place to live in. Criticizing destability by immigrant expansion is allowed there, and some conservative notes are tolerated.

 

Most definitely the Netherlands and France are not, I fear. Over here you will be forced to abdicate if you criticize "reproductive rights" (that is: the abortion slaughter mills) etc. Though I think we might be approaching a lash back on the liberal left establishment in future. The present "new" parties are merely focused on anti-Islamism, and not aware of the greater threats to Dutch society, like aging, population diminishing, ghettos and moral collapse.

 

But time will come.

 

I think Lepen just tried to "please" the French secular right by these statements: Marshall Pétain is loved by them and after all until the start of the Jew deportations he was an ally of Nazi Germany. Catholic Right Wing in France is more focused upon State-Church relationship, the Monarchy (Vive le Roi. Dieu et le Roi!) and morality issues.

 

I personally like Bruno Mégret more than Lepen. Lepen might have had his children baptized by SSPX priests, but he is not a real Roman Catholic himself, at least as far as I know. Then I mean: my standards of being Roman Catholic, that is: practising.

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