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Author Topic: Is Communion on the Hand a sin?  (Read 6789 times)
creimann
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« Reply #90 on: February 05, 2006, 01:06:PM »

Quote from: gladius_veritatis
Not so with the re-introduction of this practice by the heretics in the West

Correct.

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Marty
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« Reply #91 on: February 05, 2006, 04:59:PM »

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Defensor_Fidei
Guest
« Reply #92 on: February 06, 2006, 12:35:AM »

Quote from: InquisitorGeneralis
A Pastoral Region refers to a group of parishes within a particular geographical area who collaborate with one another.

And the Church has functioned like this for 2000 years.  This is nothing new.

 

Quote from: InquisitorGeneralis
 I object to the term on the grounds that it is a novelty.  That, and I don't like the way it sounds.  It reminds me of all those liberals who wanted a "pastoral pope."

 

The regions were around well before VII.  What do you think an auxillary Bishop does? California has had many auxillary Bishops under the Bishop or Cardinal who presides over the diocese.  In California for example Bishop John Joseph Cantwell had auxillary Bishops under him as his territory was huge before Moterey and San Diego split off  The archdiocese is huge, many of us believe it should have been split up long ago.  There are over 10 million Catholics in the LAD.

 

Is everything a novelty to you?  FCOL,  Diocese control hundred even thousands of buildings (hospitals, schools and parishes), own real property, are gifted property and assets from the estates of the deceased, There are serious logistical issues that a diocese has to deal with every day, creating pastoral regions and deaneries are very logical and really a good idea.

 

-DF

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InquisitorGeneralis
Guest
« Reply #93 on: February 06, 2006, 01:06:AM »

Quote from: Defensor_Fidei

Quote from: InquisitorGeneralis
A Pastoral Region  refers to a group of parishes within a particular geographical area who  collaborate with one another.

And the Church has functioned like this for 2000 years.  This is nothing new.

 

 


  I have no problems w/parishes collaborating.
 

 


 

Quote from: Defensor_Fidei
 

 

Quote from: InquisitorGeneralis
 I object to the term on the grounds that it is a novelty. That, and I  don't like the way it sounds. It reminds me of all those liberals who  wanted a "pastoral pope."

The  regions were around well before VII. What do you think an auxillary  Bishop does? California has had many auxillary Bishops under the Bishop  or Cardinal who presides over the diocese. In California for example  Bishop John Joseph Cantwell had auxillary Bishops under him as his  territory was huge before Moterey and San Diego split off The  archdiocese is huge, many of us believe it should have been split up  long ago. There are over 10 million Catholics in the LAD.

Is  everything a novelty to you? FCOL, Diocese control hundred even  thousands of buildings (hospitals, schools and parishes), own real  property, are gifted property and assets from the estates of the  deceased, There are serious logistical issues that a diocese has to  deal with every day, creating pastoral regions and deaneries are very  logical and really a good idea.

-DF

 
  Again, I don't object to the underlying concept, just the term.  We trads have certain sensibilities about such things.
 
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VoxClamantis
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« Reply #94 on: February 06, 2006, 03:22:PM »

Quote from: Defensor_Fidei
Quote from: VoxClamantis
 

Break the argument down here: Defensor Fidei agrees that Communion in the hand is less good than Communion on the tongue (why?). But his argument seems to go like this: It was allowed in the early Church (a question of fact which has yet to be proved insofar as "Communion in the hand" is understood to be the regular way of doing things) so, therefore, it is not a sin."

 

IT is not a question of fact.  Taking the information we have provided by those who have studied the Liturgy, it is shown that CIH not just existed up through the 7th century, it is a logical use when you consider things like practicality leavened bread and the development of the rites.

 

I am thinking you might not understand what "question of fact" means.

 

Quote from: DefensorFidei

Quote from: Vox
Obviously, there is nothing inherently sinful about touching the Host, or else one could never touch it for any reason, even so that good may come from it, such as rescuing it from Satanists or what not. But it is apparent from the recent past that Communion in the hand leads to desecration, to disbelief in the Real Presence, to a blurring of the lines between the ordained and royal priesthoods, etc. Knowing this is so -- knowing that Communion in the hand harms the proper understanding of the Faith and to desecration (dropped particles, etc.) -- to needlessly handle the Sacrament is sacrilegious, which is a sin.

 

I disagree with your opinion (in bold).  Reading the development of the Liturgy it is evident that disbelief in the RP was not the issue.  The issues of concern had to do with people abusing the sacrament by not eating it.

 

I never said that the reason for the immediate pre-Vatican II practice was to prevent disbelief in the RP, though it is obvious that it enhanced belief in the RP. As to the rest, you might want to read about church cleaners finding the Sacrament under pews, about World Youth Days where the Sacrament is passed around in cardboard boxes like so many potato chips (and end up in the mud underfoot), of Satanists running off with it, etc. And it seems obvious to me that the more reverently we treat the Blessed Sacrament, the more people will believe in the Real Presence, and conversely, if we treat it like a snack, it will be seen as a snack.

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Marty
Guest
« Reply #95 on: February 06, 2006, 05:04:PM »

Quote from: VoxClamantis
it seems obvious to me that the more reverently we treat the Blessed Sacrament, the more people will believe in the Real Presence, and conversely, if we treat it like a snack, it will be seen as a snack.

Thats it in a nutshell boss.

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